Blasphemy & Genocide: Unpopular Green Day Opinions, Part 2

[Libertine Angel]

19 hours ago, Jane Lannister said:

What makes it sappy are the lyrics. I'm afraid they don't get much better even if I try to cut him some slack (cause he was young and in love and all that jazz ) I can tolerate sappy old songs mainly because they are forgotten: e.g. 1000 Hours. 

I would easily take 1000 Hours over When It's Time, the latter's lyrically just so simplistic and uninteresting.

[Hermione]

I like Billie's quote about 1000 Hours:

Quote

Not only was it not for a band to play or to play as a band, it's just the sappiest song about a girl, to the point where it's like a bad John Hughes movie!

Have to agree, I think it's the only one that's bit too sappy even for me . Bring on all the others though.

[JOE THE X-KID]

On 15/11/2016 at 8:54 PM, DookieLukie said:

Here's my opinion: Green Day fans go crazy for sappy/poppy Green Day songs because they like Green Day the best when they make Top 40 music. I think people who like "Still Breathing" or "When It's Time" etc really just like pop/Top 40 music and also happen to like Green Day. TLDR: People want Green Day to be a pop band but won't admit it because it's cooler to like a punk band.

This is not true at all. I love when it's time and still breathing.  my favourite album is Insomniac and I love heavy music.

[nick.]

So I kinda see the chant at the AMAs as part genuine and part publicity stunt. I've noticed a lot of GD fans describe the performance as "awesome" and "brave." I agree with the awesome description but not brave. In fact, I would venture to say that calling out Trump is at this point not only safe, but a guaranteed crowd pleaser and instant "trending" status. So I can't help but see Green Day as pandering for the publicity and to maybe even rekindle some old American Idiot flames. It really is a shame. By the way, I did not vote Trump or Hillary and thought the act was great otherwise.

[Leni.]

7 minutes ago, nick. said:

So I kinda see the chant at the AMAs as part genuine and part publicity stunt. I've noticed a lot of GD fans describe the performance as "awesome" and "brave." I agree with the awesome description but not brave. In fact, I would venture to say that calling out Trump is at this point not only safe, but a guaranteed crowd pleaser and instant "trending" status. So I can't help but see Green Day as pandering for the publicity and to maybe even rekindle some old American Idiot flames. It really is a shame. By the way, I did not vote Trump or Hillary and thought the act was great otherwise.

I, personally, see it as nothing new. They were against Trump on the US tour all the time. It's not like this would be the first moment, so I assume it's not really for being "trendy". As we can see many people are posting hate comments, more than people who praise them for what they did there - what I've seen and read at least. Of course they did it on TV - if they would shut up about it now, then all the pre-election speeches would look like they said that to be popular. There is no guarantee that after saying this on live TV will be safe way how to gain popularity. Things work both ways - new fans will come as some of the old ones will turn their backs to the band. I think it's more about the election made people come  back to AI and revive their memories on how they felt during the 2004's election - so the old fans who probably stopped follow the band for different reasons. And that's nothing shocking for me. But I think that I get what you mean, but I don't think things like popularity or being trendy matters to them at the end of the day at this period. 

[RougeRogue]

4 hours ago, nick. said:

So I kinda see the chant at the AMAs as part genuine and part publicity stunt. I've noticed a lot of GD fans describe the performance as "awesome" and "brave." I agree with the awesome description but not brave. In fact, I would venture to say that calling out Trump is at this point not only safe, but a guaranteed crowd pleaser and instant "trending" status. So I can't help but see Green Day as pandering for the publicity and to maybe even rekindle some old American Idiot flames. It really is a shame. By the way, I did not vote Trump or Hillary and thought the act was great otherwise.

 

4 hours ago, Ellen Caulfield said:

I, personally, see it as nothing new. They were against Trump on the US tour all the time. It's not like this would be the first moment, so I assume it's not really for being "trendy". As we can see many people are posting hate comments, more than people who praise them for what they did there - what I've seen and read at least. Of course they did it on TV - if they would shut up about it now, then all the pre-election speeches would look like they said that to be popular. There is no guarantee that after saying this on live TV will be safe way how to gain popularity. Things work both ways - new fans will come as some of the old ones will turn their backs to the band. I think it's more about the election made people come  back to AI and revive their memories on how they felt during the 2004's election - so the old fans who probably stopped follow the band for different reasons. And that's nothing shocking for me. But I think that I get what you mean, but I don't think things like popularity or being trendy matters to them at the end of the day at this period. 

For trendy reasons no, but it was absolutely scripted and intentional. I mean, Mike + Jason backed the chant as if it were as ingrained as the backing vocal tracks themselves. These shows have zero room for spontaneity and they definitely would not leave anything to chance with Billie's track record. I'm sure they had to get it cleared by the AMA people (and subsequently their own people) well beforehand. Green Day are, unfortunately, too big to ever truly escape the corporate world.

[Leni.]

3 hours ago, RougeRogue said:

For trendy reasons no, but it was absolutely scripted and intentional. I mean, Mike + Jason backed the chant as if it were as ingrained as the backing vocal tracks themselves. These shows have zero room for spontaneity and they definitely would not leave anything to chance with Billie's track record. I'm sure they had to get it cleared by the AMA people (and subsequently their own people) well beforehand. Green Day are, unfortunately, too big to ever truly escape the corporate world.

Yes, I agree with you. I know that Mike and Jason, probably Jason and Jeff too, were doing backing vocals for this. I reffered much more to the idea of doing so which came from the band IMO, because they've already acquainted us with what they think before. If their staff and management knew, I think they did, that's another thing, which I didn't include in my post at all, because I wasn't there to hear their conversation. But I'm not saying it didn't happen.

I think that more people hate the band now, which I think isn't the sign of gaining popularity in a good way IMHO. So even if it was constructed and planned it clearly has its own dark side, which won't help to sell the album, because many fans don't agree with the band on the politics and stopped following the band. That's what I think at least. Green Day are still pretty big, but not on the same level as pop acts, but enough to be heard. 

[Hermione]

I think the majority of Green Day fans share their views and/or weren't surprised or bothered by what they did. The fans who didn't like it are a minority, they just shout about it louder (as is usually the way with people who agree with something vs people who disagree).

It obviously was planned by the whole band but I don't see why it would necessarily have to be cleared with the AMA people? They just inserted it into the middle of the song so we don't know either way.

[Nova-Caine]

1 minute ago, Hermione said:

I think the majority of Green Day fans share their views and/or weren't surprised or bothered by what they did. The fans who didn't like it are a minority, they just shout about it louder (as is usually the way with people who agree with something vs people who disagree).

It obviously was planned by the whole band but I don't see why it would necessarily have to be cleared with the AMA people? They just inserted it into the middle of the song so we don't know either way.

I know it wasn't done in Rehearsal, haha sneaky lil buggers

[Hermione]

Just now, Nova-Caine said:

I know it wasn't done in Rehearsal, haha sneaky lil buggers

Excellent  

[DeJennsitized]

On ‎15‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 8:54 PM, DookieLukie said:

Here's my opinion: Green Day fans go crazy for sappy/poppy Green Day songs because they like Green Day the best when they make Top 40 music. I think people who like "Still Breathing" or "When It's Time" etc really just like pop/Top 40 music and also happen to like Green Day. TLDR: People want Green Day to be a pop band but won't admit it because it's cooler to like a punk band.

That's kind of confusing and I'm trying to make sense of it. I love Still Breathing but not a huge fan of When It's Time. I love BOBD but not 21 Guns. I love Lady Gaga but I also love the Ramones. So where do I fit?  

Or here's an idea: People can be a fan of Top 40 music AND be a fan of Green Day without specifically wanting them to 'be a pop band'. Just because people love the lighter stuff doesn't mean they can't also like the heavier stuff.

[stories and songs]

I keep reading that the AMA people didn't know about the chant—that it was something they decided on shortly before the show, so they weren't really withholding information but they didn't give notice either. IDK how true it is, but if it is true, I love it. 

I understand the above arguments, but here's why I think what they did actually was brave: How many other popular artists are gutsy enough to state their political opinion, let alone let it be known on national television? They don't care about the hate, and it's mostly not coming from their fans, but it's still hate nonetheless. Most artists in their position wouldn't dream of compromising any popularity in favor of speaking out. Among the celebrity crowd and among their fans, Green Day's opinion is the popular one. But they live in a country that voted otherwise, so yeah, it's still brave. I'd think it strange if they were anti-Trump pre-election and then just went silent after he was elected. That's not them.

[Thatsername]

1 hour ago, stories and songs said:

I understand the above arguments, but here's why I think what they did actually was brave: How many other popular artists are gutsy enough to state their political opinion, let alone let it be known on national television? They don't care about the hate, and it's mostly not coming from their fans, but it's still hate nonetheless. Most artists in their position wouldn't dream of compromising any popularity in favor of speaking out.

I agree, it's very brave in many ways, not only morally. Right-wing-powers - and also right-wing-violence - is on the rise and you can never tell if there are some people amongst a crowd of haters who are actually willing to become violent. And when you're famous and speak out the way GD does, you always become a target for (potentially violent) haters. And with the crazy gun culture and weapon law in the USA - which surely won't get better with a President Trump - it's really brave as hell to stand in the spotlight and still hold on to your opinion the way they do. Sometimes when I think about this I get worried about them. But at the same time, my respect for those three guys grows bigger and bigger (if that is even possible). I am so proud to call myself a GD fan in these troubled times.

[stories and songs]

^ @MMwhatsername Honestly, yesterday morning I woke up worried about them for the very reasons you stated. People can be really scary, particularly when you're talking about stuff like gun rights and the KKK. I admire their bravery in speaking out about stuff like this, but it also makes me a bit nervous. That's why I really don't want to discredit anything they do publicly to support their political views—it's not without risk.

[Wretched & Divine]

I share the same concerns as you guys about them having targets on their heads for these extremists. I don't know what venue security is like in countries where carrying guns in the norm? (okay, in the US) Because you don't get scanned going to concerts in Australia, just a bag check (which is actually more to make sure you're not taking in your own bloody water bottles). And it's not like these concerns are baseless after what happened to Christina Grimmie, and she hadn't even done anything to make a target of herself  It's a greater risk at M&G's though, I think, since it would be pretty difficult to pull a gun and get in a shot on target at a concert. Even typing that made my stomach clench. But hey, Paris on Nov. 13 proves anything is possible. Why are people so psychotic?

[stories and songs]

@Wretched & Divine I actually think at the U.S. club tour, a lot of people saw security dogs, which is good. At U.S. stadiums, it varies—some have metal detectors, others just do bag checks. 

Of course if it were up to me, Green Day concert security would be as strict as U.S. airports. 

[solongfromthestars]

I love Christian's Inferno.

Was meh about it for a while but nah, I love it. Also I wish they'd play it live

 

[SomeNimrod97]

I'm back after god knows how long and I've grown to find Somewhere Now as the most boring song from RevRad. I don't think it's the worst song as I like all songs equally, unlike the Trilogy, but I just find Somewhere Now has something missing at either end of the song, which was rectified with the reprise on the end of Forever Now.

[TimmyChunks]

9 hours ago, stories and songs said:

@Wretched & Divine I actually think at the U.S. club tour, a lot of people saw security dogs, which is good. At U.S. stadiums, it varies—some have metal detectors, others just do bag checks. 

Of course if it were up to me, Green Day concert security would be as strict as U.S. airports. 

I'm sure you've noticed the semi-automatic firearm discharge that was played over the last chorus...this was eerily similar to what can be heard in the Bartaclan videos (for example, the CNN video of when the gunfire began). Super chilling and unsettling. Did anyone else notice this? Chilling, and also artistically a very poignant placement of effects if this was intentional.

Going back a little on this thread, I am in the moderate camp politically and am somewhat skeptical but not overly distraught over Trump. In other words, I think he  sucks but it's not the end of the world. And I also don't completely agree with Green Day politically, but I absolutely love what they did at the AMA performance. I love that they speak their mind, that they're so passionate about this cause. Even when it's something I completely disagree with I still totally respect and love that they voice their opinons so strongly. It's what makes our country great. I don't understand the mindset of the people criticizing them regardless of political beliefs- agree or disagree on issues, we should all be thrilled that we have the ability to express our thoughts and have the freedom of speech. There's nothing more American than that.

[petros]

You guys do realize that apart from here no one is taking green day seriously anymore on their political shit? I've been seeing it a lot in articles comments even on other bands forums. People that are not fanboys or fangirls make fun of billie calling trump hitler and the whole kkk rant on amas. 

I don't agree with the disrespectful way they talk about the band I've been loving for like 9 years but they have some points. Billie Joe needs to stop bitching cause he comes off as trying to jump on that wagon of hating Trump and trying to use that to sell more records. I mean revrad is a really cool album imo and it's not really political but they try to use politics I guess to make it more relevant and sell more copies? Also maybe it was fresh and new in 2004 but now 12 years later doing the same shit you did back then with Bush but also being and looking 12 years older doesn't make you look cool.

If you wanna just reply with "It's billie he can say whatever he wants, he has an opinion, he wants to state it" I know and I don't care. It's the unpopular opinion thread and I'm trying to discuss and make you think if you haven't on how green day and mostly Billie come off during this last month or so. I have stated it even before the elections I wasn't really keen on Billie attacking on trump on every chance he got and people got mad at me for saying. Now I see so many people feeling the same now as I did even back then(things have obviously gone worst now) I'd like to have a genuine conversation with you people. 

[belinda jane]

8 minutes ago, petros said:

You guys do realize that apart from here no one is taking green day seriously anymore on their political shit? I've been seeing it a lot in articles comments even on other bands forums. People that are not fanboys or fangirls make fan of billie calling trump hitler and the whole kkk rant on amas. 

I don't agree with the disrespectful way they talk about the band I've been loving for like 9 years but they have some points. Billie Joe needs to stop bitching cause he comes off as trying to jump on that wagon of hating Trump and trying to use that to sell more records. I mean revrad is a really cool album imo and it's not really political but they try to use politics I guess to make it more relevant and sell more copies? Also maybe it was fresh and new in 2004 but now 12 years later doing the same shit you did back then with Bush but also being and looking 12 years older doesn't make you look cool.

If you wanna just reply with "It's billie he can say whatever he wants, he has an opinion, he wants to state it" I know and I don't care. It's the unpopular opinion thread and I'm trying to discuss and make you think if you haven't on how green day and mostly Billie come off during this last month or so. I have stated it even before the elections I wasn't really keen on Billie attacking on trump on every chance he got and people got mad at me for saying. Now I see so many people feeling the same now as I did even back then(things have obviously gone worst now) I'd like to have a genuine conversation with you people. 

i agree (to some extent).
i agree with the part about it being 12 years later, and doing the same shit as back then isn't cool. i'm a bit over it, too. they've done that already, and obviously it was successful - it doesn't need to happen again.
obviously, i still think they have every right to express themselves and they shouldn't be forced to be silenced. BUT in saying that, i really hope they don't drag this on.
the chants were enough on the AMA's, and i honestly think they've made their point and they don't need to prove themselves anymore on how much they hate trump.

i also think that those interviews with billie speaking only about the election didn't help, because they were literally all over my FB feed, etc. so i can't help but think the casual green day fan would have been way over it if i'm feeling that way.

i think they need to move on now and just focus on the album and the tour. they don't need to make any more of a statement than they already have.

[nick.]

55 minutes ago, belinda jane said:

i agree (to some extent).
i agree with the part about it being 12 years later, and doing the same shit as back then isn't cool. i'm a bit over it, too. they've done that already, and obviously it was successful - it doesn't need to happen again.
obviously, i still think they have every right to express themselves and they shouldn't be forced to be silenced. BUT in saying that, i really hope they don't drag this on.
the chants were enough on the AMA's, and i honestly think they've made their point and they don't need to prove themselves anymore on how much they hate trump.

i also think that those interviews with billie speaking only about the election didn't help, because they were literally all over my FB feed, etc. so i can't help but think the casual green day fan would have been way over it if i'm feeling that way.

i think they need to move on now and just focus on the album and the tour. they don't need to make any more of a statement than they already have.

I think the thing that bums me out is it feels like rehashed emotion for the media attention in order to sell records. I can't say I blame Billie 100% because honestly it seems like most interviewers are egging him on in a way but he plays right in. I miss the 90's era Green Day that didn't come off quite as somber and over dramatic. In old interviews Billie and the guys seemed a bit more real and less pandering if that makes sense. To some it up I feel like Green Day takes themselves very seriously now and it shows in the music. Makes me worry we may never get a return to Nimrod or Insomniac era punk rock music. 

[belinda jane]

4 minutes ago, nick. said:

I think the thing that bums me out is it feels like rehashed emotion for the media attention in order to sell records. I can't say I blame Billie 100% because honestly it seems like most interviewers are egging him on in a way but he plays right in. I miss the 90's era Green Day that didn't come off quite as somber and over dramatic. In old interviews Billie and the guys seemed a bit more real and less pandering if that makes sense. To some it up I feel like Green Day takes themselves very seriously now and it shows in the music. Makes me worry we may never get a return to Nimrod or Insomniac era punk rock music. 

it could be just maturity, though. i would even love them to go back to 'warning', but i don't think it'll happen.
it bums me out that interviewers feel the need to egg him/them on about the election, and i think that is mainly because AI was so huge and pretty much the whole world knows how they feel about politics. social media has definitely not helped, because he has been bashing trump non-stop on IG. that was not around when AI was released, so i think that makes even more of an impact.
bring back 2004. haha.

[stories and songs]

I agree that there are many people who aren't taking Green Day's politics seriously, but support for them speaking out does, in fact, extend beyond this site. I've see so many people online applaud them who say they aren't even fans of their music. I personally know people who respect what they did and don't normally listen to them. Haters are loud, no matter what you're discussing. But Green Day also got a huge outpouring of support and respect for what they did. I'm not saying this wearing rose-colored glasses–I'm very aware of how they come off to outsiders, and not just in this instance.

Art is innately political. I think expecting artists to stop talking politics and just focus on the music is an oxymoron, particularly when songs like Holiday, Warning, and Say Goodbye sit in their catalog.

As for them milking the election for better album sales...I can't speak to why they're focusing on Trump so much, because I have no way of knowing their true intentions. But I will say that liberal-leaning people who care about political and social issues to begin with have been shaken to the core by this election. It's a very genuine reaction to be angry and confused and afraid for many of us. For many, it really does feel that grim and scary right now. Knowing the band's political views, I truly believe they've been hit just as hard by this as regular people like me who also want to continue the conversation about what's going on in the country. If I believed this band took hollow political stances for more fame and money, they sure as hell wouldn't be my favorite band.

[Leni.]

4 hours ago, petros said:

You guys do realize that apart from here no one is taking green day seriously anymore on their political shit? I've been seeing it a lot in articles comments even on other bands forums. People that are not fanboys or fangirls make fan of billie calling trump hitler and the whole kkk rant on amas. 

I don't agree with the disrespectful way they talk about the band I've been loving for like 9 years but they have some points. Billie Joe needs to stop bitching cause he comes off as trying to jump on that wagon of hating Trump and trying to use that to sell more records. I mean revrad is a really cool album imo and it's not really political but they try to use politics I guess to make it more relevant and sell more copies? Also maybe it was fresh and new in 2004 but now 12 years later doing the same shit you did back then with Bush but also being and looking 12 years older doesn't make you look cool.

If you wanna just reply with "It's billie he can say whatever he wants, he has an opinion, he wants to state it" I know and I don't care. It's the unpopular opinion thread and I'm trying to discuss and make you think if you haven't on how green day and mostly Billie come off during this last month or so. I have stated it even before the elections I wasn't really keen on Billie attacking on trump on every chance he got and people got mad at me for saying. Now I see so many people feeling the same now as I did even back then(things have obviously gone worst now) I'd like to have a genuine conversation with you people. 

I get what you mean, but for several reasons I think the band is stating their views not because it's safe for them to jump on this hate train, because as you said many people don't even take them seriously and hate them for doing that. And I just want to point out to you that my reasons are way beyond than being a fangirl. It's not really nice from you to call people like that even if you don't agree with their opinions.

I will try to explain my reasons. It'll be hard for me cuz I'm not good at expresing my thoughts with words that much, so please excuse my post if it sounds somehow weird.  

As a person who is interested in "how to read people's mind" - the mentalism, facial expressions and body language in general, the use of words, intonation etc. I "read" the band's expression as natural and not fake or constructed for popularity - which is bullshit IMHO cuz it clearly doesn't work as you said before. I really don't care how many fans this band has, it has nothing to do with me. And fuck the popularity.

That night during the AMA performance, the camera was mostly on BJ's face so I'll mostly talk about him obviously. I'm going to see the video and write down the time here that you can have more clear idea what I'm reffering to exactly. And that's not really comfortable for me to talk about them like this.
At the mark of 0:12 you can see Mike's face saying that he know's he's going to do something "controversial". He's little bit excited and afraid at the same time. At 0:25 he express his excitement but also finds self-confidence in what is he going to do, and clearly stands behind his believes. At 0:42-43 you can see behind BJ's eyes that he has his doubts about people's reactions to him. It lasts until 1:10, he's staring for several seconds at one place then another one, and you can see he's got his inner dialogue. After the first verse nervosity and excitement takes place, because he had managed to get through the first verse,and his eyes are more distracted now. At 1:32 starts another part with doubts and inner dialogue. Until 1:40 where he's making his first eye contact with the crowd out of his inner thoughts. He raises his eyebrows a little bit, so that means he's showing his honesty and that he's persuaded about what he's doing is right. Around 1:50 he's looking for the reaction from the crowd and at 1:53 he's expressing his honesty again and again at the 1:55 his doubts again and at 1:57 honesty again. At 2:05 you can feel the nervosity mostly again. At 2:10 he knows the next thing he's going to do would be hard to do so he's gathering his courage by his facial expression (it works both ways - for example if you want to gain self-confidence stand straight, make sure your feet make open angle and your body feels strong, etc.) At 2:19 you can see he's moving the arms out of the guitar and let them along his body which represents his courage and mostly his honesty again. At 2:25 his look turns to left to find some understanding in the audience. The most important part is at 1:33 where his eyes opens up and this is Billie Joe when he is completely in the moment and his facial muscles unfreeze, which is really hard to do in front of so many people you've never met before and probably nobody is able to do it consciously. So that means his inner self is making its way out. At 3:12 he makes that little move with the eyebrows when he is trying to find another reaction. I'll jump at the end to 3:41 and to be honest you can hardly do this face if you don't have the right feelings, this can't be made up because some facial muscles you can't use consciously or it's really hard to if you're not working really hard on that. The eyes always say everything.

I hope my post won't kill anybody, it really was a hard job  I might make some mistakes and I'm not saying I'm right I just gave you the reasons why I don't think this was fake or for making their new record sell better. You wanted discussion, here I am.