astoria Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I thought the trilogy to be a nod to the past, while at the same time showing how the band has grown since Dookie. I will admit I LOVE Nightlife (you all may judge me now) but I also liked and was exposed to Lady Cobra before she got involved in that song. I agree that many of the lyrics were redundant but I feel they really did tell a story. The only song I have a problem with on the Trilogy is The Forgotten but that may be just because I overplayed it when Tre came out. One thing I love most about the trilogy is the new and improved guitar sound including more Jason White. He is seriously talented and I am excited for him to be stepping up as a true fourth member not just "that other guy". Some experimentation worked (KtDJ, Brutal Love), other times less so (Nightlife). I'd rather have I Run NY on Dos! I agree I Run NY should have been on Dos! I did love Nightlife however. This may be because I was exposed to Mystic Knights of the Cobra prior to the release of Dos!. All in all, I'm glad they experimented and look forward to more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudley dawson Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 I think much of the hate comes from: 1. Poor album sales. Had these all (or any) been successes, I'm willing to bet many of you would change your tune. 2. Not getting another rock opera. Many of you love AI and 21stCB so much, the fact Green Day went back to doing simple pop punk disappointed you. 3. Others not liking it. One person says something negative and it snowballs from there. I'll take the argument of AI being better (even though I disagree with it), however arguing 21stCB as better is PRETTY ridiculous. To me, that is their worst album bar none. Overproduced and compressed beyond belief, that album barely gets played by me anymore. Are you really going to tell me The Static Age (a poor man's Church on Sunday) is better than Sweet 16? Seriously? Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteTim Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I think much of the hate comes from: 1. Poor album sales. Had these all (or any) been successes, I'm willing to bet many of you would change your tune. 2. Not getting another rock opera. Many of you love AI and 21stCB so much, the fact Green Day went back to doing simple pop punk disappointed you. 3. Others not liking it. One person says something negative and it snowballs from there. I'll take the argument of AI being better (even though I disagree with it), however arguing 21stCB as better is PRETTY ridiculous. To me, that is their worst album bar none. Overproduced and compressed beyond belief, that album barely gets played by me anymore. Are you really going to tell me The Static Age (a poor man's Church on Sunday) is better than Sweet 16? Seriously? Lol. Static Age is MILES better than Sweet 16... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z J Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 This thread. This thread is the first one I see when I'm advised to go to other places on GDC besides unpopular opinions. The trilogy CAN NOT be Green Day's best work. Forget opinions. It lacks what Green Day is at their core. Harmonies and bass lines with clever/relatable lyricism. At no point during the trilogy can I hear Billie joe's signature snarl through that god awful vocal filter. At no point are the guitars strong enough to wake a baby. At no point can I hear those beautiful an subtle harmonies between Mike and Billie. At very few points do I hear Billie's signature lyrical wit. The trilogy does not represent Green Day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaïs. Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Static Age is MILES better than Sweet 16... I think this is the first time I've liked one of your posts. I'll take the argument of AI being better (even though I disagree with it), however arguing 21stCB as better is PRETTY ridiculous. To me, that is their worst album bar none. Overproduced and compressed beyond belief, that album barely gets played by me anymore. Are you really going to tell me The Static Age (a poor man's Church on Sunday) is better than Sweet 16? Seriously? Lol. It's not overproduced. If GD had used the Trilogy's production for 21CB, it would have sucked ass. 21CB, like it or not, is a sweeping, rambling, epic album and needs production to match. And it's actually trying to say something honest. Songs like "East Jesus Nowhere" and "Last Night on Earth" are exponentially more emotionally honest and real than anything on the Trilogy save "Lazy Bones". And "Sweet 16" *sucks* compared to "The Static Age". Also, you can't say shit about a song being a poor man's *anything* if you're saying all of the recycled melodies and progressions of the Trilogy are among the best things they've ever done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z J Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I think much of the hate comes from: 1. Poor album sales. Had these all (or any) been successes, I'm willing to bet many of you would change your tune. 2. Not getting another rock opera. Many of you love AI and 21stCB so much, the fact Green Day went back to doing simple pop punk disappointed you. 3. Others not liking it. One person says something negative and it snowballs from there. I'll take the argument of AI being better (even though I disagree with it), however arguing 21stCB as better is PRETTY ridiculous. To me, that is their worst album bar none. Overproduced and compressed beyond belief, that album barely gets played by me anymore. Are you really going to tell me The Static Age (a poor man's Church on Sunday) is better than Sweet 16? Seriously? Lol. I don't like the trilogy at all, and none of these 3 things listed has anything to do with it. Static Age is so much better than Sweet 16. Lyrically it is easily better. And production wise it isn't even close. Billie's voice is incredible in Static Age, especially on the bridge. Sweet 16's vocal makes Billie sound like a child. The only thing I like about it is the solo. Very nostalgic All of 21cb is better because the lyrics are among their best work, and the incorporation of piano and many other changes in style reflect a maturation that is not seen at all in the trilogy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagelfeet Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 To all of the people saying that it is their worst work, I'd like to introduce you to the word opinion. Seriously though, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so just because you say something like "forget opinions" or "the lyrics are bad" doesn't mean that everyone else has to think that. You can think that the Trilogy is bad, but who am I to tell you to think differently? I really don't think that some of the people who dislike the trilogy are being fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaïs. Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 To all of the people saying that it is their worst work, I'd like to introduce you to the word opinion. Seriously though, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, so just because you say something like "forget opinions" or "the lyrics are bad" doesn't mean that everyone else has to think that. You can think that the Trilogy is bad, but who am I to tell you to think differently? I really don't think that some of the people who dislike the trilogy are being fair. Regardless of your opinion, there are aspects of judging music that are objective. Objectively, the Trilogy is nowhere near as musically creative as AI and 21CB. Objectively, I'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDERI'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDERI'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDER is a far poorer work of lyrical writing than 90% of AI/21CB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Ride The Lightning and Master Of Puppets are where it's at dude. Yeah, they're great. I have a Master of Puppets t-shirt. But I like St. Anger too. #AlbumsWithOrangeCovers #UnderRated #StAnger #Dos #INB4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagelfeet Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Regardless of your opinion, there are aspects of judging music that are objective. Objectively, the Trilogy is nowhere near as musically creative as AI and 21CB. Objectively, I'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDERI'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDERI'LLMAKEYOUSURRENDER is a far poorer work of lyrical writing than 90% of AI/21CB. But really that could be seen as an opinion too. I mean, I do agree with you to some extent, but really the whole argument with comparing it to AI and 21stCB is kind of stupid. It's not like they were meant to be compared to them anyway. And btw, I'm pretty sure the Trilogy has way more creative solos than anything on either of those two albums, but then again, that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteTim Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I think this is the first time I've liked one of your posts. Damn am I that bad? Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleasedToMeetMe Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 The thing that really bothers me is that is seems because the band made American Idiot and also 21st Century Breakdown, people seem to think they are not allowed to play any other style of music. The reason why I love the trilogy is because it is a breath of fresh air after 21CBD and alot of it has that Nimrod/Warning era sound. It has some of their best songs as well as some of their worst songs, but people need to stop being so critical and picking everything apart and just enjoy the fucking music. Green Day will make more music, do more things. If you can write or play something better, do it. If not, stop acting like these songs are the worst things to ever come in contact with your ears. It could be MUCH worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaïs. Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 The thing that really bothers me is that is seems because the band made American Idiot and also 21st Century Breakdown, people seem to think they are not allowed to play any other style of music. The reason why I love the trilogy is because it is a breath of fresh air after 21CBD and alot of it has that Nimrod/Warning era sound. It has some of their best songs as well as some of their worst songs, but people need to stop being so critical and picking everything apart and just enjoy the fucking music. Green Day will make more music, do more things. If you can write or play something better, do it. If not, stop acting like these songs are the worst things to ever come in contact with your ears. It could be MUCH worse. 1. Warning is my second-favorite GD album and I still fucking hate the Trilogy. The issue is that it's bad at what it does, not that it's different. 2. I fucking hate the fallacy of "If you can do better, do it, otherwise you can't criticize." I can't paint worth a damn, but I can tell the difference between the quality of the Mona Lisa and a shitty painting. I can't cook, but I know a shitty hamburger when I taste it. I can't play guitar, but I know when the tone is too weak and the progressions are repetitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clockwise Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 The trilogy is my favorite thing Green Day have ever done. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bagelfeet Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 The trilogy is my favorite thing Green Day have ever done. Ever. so I'm not the only one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DookieLukie Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 1. Warning is my second-favorite GD album and I still fucking hate the Trilogy. The issue is that it's bad at what it does, not that it's different. 2. I fucking hate the fallacy of "If you can do better, do it, otherwise you can't criticize." I can't paint worth a damn, but I can tell the difference between the quality of the Mona Lisa and a shitty painting. I can't cook, but I know a shitty hamburger when I taste it. I can't play guitar, but I know when the tone is too weak and the progressions are repetitive. I agree with point #2. So many people defend their shitty music with the "Can you do better?" excuse. That's like a doctor butchering a patient during surgery and saying "Hah...like you could do better!" People are expected to do their job well if they are being paid for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudley dawson Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Sweet 16, Lazy Bones, 8th Ave Serenade, and X Kid > any songs on 21stCB. The only really good songs on 21stCB are Restless Heart Syndrome (which is almost ruined with all the guitar thrashing towards the end) and 21 Guns. The rest ranges from good to mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaïs. Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Sweet 16, Lazy Bones, 8th Ave Serenade, and X Kid > any songs on 21stCB. The only really good songs on 21stCB are Restless Heart Syndrome (which is almost ruined with all the guitar thrashing towards the end) and 21 Guns. The rest ranges from good to mediocre. The title track. Viva la Gloria? (Little Girl). East Jesus fucking Nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteTim Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudley dawson Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 The title track. Viva la Gloria? (Little Girl). East Jesus fucking Nowhere. All good songs, but I like the ones mentioned above more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 It's not overproduced. If GD had used the Trilogy's production for 21CB, it would have sucked ass. 21CB, like it or not, is a sweeping, rambling, epic album and needs production to match. And it's actually trying to say something honest. Songs like "East Jesus Nowhere" and "Last Night on Earth" are exponentially more emotionally honest and real than anything on the Trilogy save "Lazy Bones". And "Sweet 16" *sucks* compared to "The Static Age". Also, you can't say shit about a song being a poor man's *anything* if you're saying all of the recycled melodies and progressions of the Trilogy are among the best things they've ever done. I'm firmly in the camp of Breakdown being vastly superior to the Trilogy, but I'd argue the production on both has issues. Obviously the Trilogy's production has been discussed to death, but Breakdown is clearly far, far too compressed. There are so many layers going on that it needs to breathe to have maximum impact. The argument for overcompression is that it makes music more powerful, but it's been proved time and time again that it's not true. If you can, get hold of the uncompressed HDTracks remaster. The output is quieter, but that's what volume buttons are for. It increases the dynamic range, so the louder parts have far greater, appropriate impact. It's been proved time and time again that less compressed music sounds better. Couldn't agree more with the rest of your post, though. I think much of the hate comes from: 1. Poor album sales. Had these all (or any) been successes, I'm willing to bet many of you would change your tune. 2. Not getting another rock opera. Many of you love AI and 21stCB so much, the fact Green Day went back to doing simple pop punk disappointed you. 3. Others not liking it. One person says something negative and it snowballs from there. 1. No. Album sales don't change how the songs sound in the slightest. 2. Also no. You'll see from the Unpopular Green Day Opinions thread that I'm of the belief we were spoiled with AI and Breakdown and everything surrounding those albums. The fact the Trilogy is simple isn't anything to do with it being lower quality. Dookie and Insomiac are far simpler and vastly superior. The Trilogy is arguably comparable with Warning and Nimrod in terms of style, and those albums are incredible. 3. Are you for real? I'd argue it's the other way around - people not liking it causes those who like it a bit to massively overreact in terms of how good they think it is and make massively hyperbolic threads like this. The thing that really bothers me is that is seems because the band made American Idiot and also 21st Century Breakdown, people seem to think they are not allowed to play any other style of music. The reason why I love the trilogy is because it is a breath of fresh air after 21CBD and alot of it has that Nimrod/Warning era sound. It has some of their best songs as well as some of their worst songs, but people need to stop being so critical and picking everything apart and just enjoy the fucking music. Green Day will make more music, do more things. If you can write or play something better, do it. If not, stop acting like these songs are the worst things to ever come in contact with your ears. It could be MUCH worse. "It could be worse" is meaningless. If the best defence an album has is that it could be worse, that doesn't exactly bode well. That's like saying "yeah it's shitty but it could be shittier." Big wow. People not being able to do better themselves doesn't mean they're not allowed to criticise anything. Ultimately a lot of the disappointment comes from the fact we want Green Day to be awesome, and they put something out that falls below the standard of anything they've done before. If you want the Nimrod/Warning sound, go listen to those albums. If you want the AI/Breakdown sound, go listen to those. Ultimately I'm sure most of us would be happy with any direction Green Day took, as long as the end result was up to the standard we've come to expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 This guy might actually be the best troll since DookieLukie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzz Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I agree the trilogy is underrated. I think it's really easy for people to shit on anything Green Day does, because hey, they're already successful multi-millionaires, so if they do something I'm not fond of it's not as simple as saying "nah, it's not my favorite thing," it has to be the hyperbolic "this is the worst thing I've ever heard." It's also annoying that people are willing to criticize the entire trilogy because they think there are some shitty songs. I loved 21CB, I hated Know Your Enemy and didn't really like Murder City. But there's music on there that I love. I don't write off the entire album. I hate Nightlife, but I love Lazy Bones and Lady Cobra. You're allowed nuance in your appreciation of music. One thing I'll agree with is that the production of the albums could have been better. They're very clean, to the point of almost feeling sterile. With their earlier albums (Dookie-Nimrod) they had the dirty guitar sounds that filled out and added a lot of character. Warning was very clean, but it also had a lot more acoustic guitars so it worked. To me that album worked because of the lyrics. It was something totally different and sounded very unlike anything in their past, so the cleaner acoustic sound seemed to fit. But you also had a song like Minority which very much felt like a throwback in style and sound to their earlier stuff. With American Idiot and 21CB both had very "large" sounds to them. The instruments filled out the album. They layered everything in a way that made a song feel epic. 21CB was 'cleaner' and at times felt over-produced, but I think it aimed for a similar sound. The trilogy on the other hand has a lot of music that felt like a throwback to the simple type of music Green Day produced early in their career, but the sound is very different. To me that type of production almost makes the music sound bored. Like the guys were in the studio just playing them half-assed or something. I'm also just talking out of my ass, because I don't produce music, the things I'm explaining are just personal observations about how they sound to my ears. I will also say that some people will prefer that style of production or can appreciate both. Lastly, GDC can be a really annoying place at times. It sucks to be a part of any community where people will go out of their way to shit on something you like. That's true of anything, and that's true of music too. You don't expect people to like everything you do, but I don't go out of my way to participate and bash stuff that I don't like. So when other people do it, it's tiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Seagull Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Haha funny, people saying AI is the best Green Day album and arguing because someone says it's not. #LOL #Haha #You know nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaïs. Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Haha funny, people saying AI is the best Green Day album and arguing because someone says it's not. #LOL #Haha #You know nothing such hipster much punk so old GD very true fan wow Ceadog, I think theanswer has taken offense to your statement about best trolls not including him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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