JAS0N Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I still disagree. I think they did 21CB because that is what they weren't expected to do, and because it was the sort of record they wanted to make. A lot of growth for the band came through with that record, and I really don't think that that would have happened had they not made it. They could have fallen by the wayside after AI, but instead they came out the better for it. These records are in answer to the previous two, even though they seem completely unrelated. I respect your thoughts on it but also disagree, 21st is exactly the result of what would be expected of a band trying to recreate the success of the previous album. It sounds like I hate 21st, I don't at all, it is however the only album GD has released though that was trying to be a classic album if you will, it felt forced. When it came naturally on Dookie and AI it was a lot more fun to listen to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angry_robot Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 To be honest, I haven't really bought this new, wild, sexed up version of Green Day from the get go. It all feels a bit forced to me - the lyrics (with of course some exceptions - the lyrics of Amy and Lazy Bones are great, for example) don't have the personal, honest quality that I'm used to with Green Day's musiche new music other than it is about "sexual tension" But has never felt quite right to me. Because in my opinion, this simply isn't what Green Day is all about. I always really liked that Green Day wasn't like other rock bands who sang about hot chicks and partying. That said, I'm generally just not feeling the theme of the albums. My thoughts exactly. Maybe it's just a personal thing, cause right now I'm not in a awesome-drunk-party period of my life and I can't relate to all these songs, I hear (and well, enjoy) them without y'know, that very-very special feeling that you have when music is somewhere inside your soul. Some songs, like Lazy Bones or Amy give that feeling, however. I just feel like Green Day grew up and I didn't. I don't understand these feelings and emotions they sing about. Well, not at all, I've been partying like hell and I know what this is all about. But still that's not what I am. Maybe I'm one of these AI era not-quite-grown-up teenage girls having butthurt cause GD changed. Again, it's more of a personal thing, I see many people like it here and I totally understand it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malleus Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I agree with you. The only songs on here that are really "throw away fun" are Fuck Time, Makeout Party, and maybe Stop When The Red Lights Flash. Everything else is a metaphor. Everyone's getting fooled by the party exterior I see. I'm going to disagree with you to a certain extent. Wow! That's Loud is also another straight up "throwaway fun" song and I think Baby Eyes is less serious than the overall tone of the album. Lady Cobra/Nightlife could also be tossed in that throwaway fun category, Nightlife having a very obvious other side though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stories and songs Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I mentioned this before but ill say it again - a lot of fans on this forum seem to be delusional in regards to the type of band Green Day is historically. Uno fits exactly with the history of the band, what longtime fans grew up with. Dos for the most part sounds like the b-sides that would be released with singles on earlier albums to be honest. If your jacked for Tre in anticipation of another concept album that's great (they already tried and failed for the most part at that with 21st) but here's hoping they stop trying to be "the biggest band in the world" and go back to their roots like they did with Uno. Well, for me it isn't the sound of the music that I'm not caring for - that is great, and is an awesome callback to their earlier material. I'm just not crazy about the lyrics for a lot of it. To my mind, Green Day often talked about more relatable, everyday life kind of stuff (fear of growing old, fighting with people you love, taking on adult responsibilities, etc) then than they are now. The music itself is fine and fits in well with the rest of their catalog. I'm a big fan of 21CB - I think it is some of the most inspired music they've written. But to each their own, of course! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homero Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I'm a big fan of 21CB - I think it is some of the most inspired music they've written. But to each their own, of course! I'm not a big fan of 21st CB but I have to say that it has some really epic moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stories and songs Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 My thoughts exactly. Maybe it's just a personal thing, cause right now I'm not in a awesome-drunk-party period of my life and I can't relate to all these songs, I hear (and well, enjoy) them without y'know, that very-very special feeling that you have when music is somewhere inside your soul. Some songs, like Lazy Bones or Amy give that feeling, however. I just feel like Green Day grew up and I didn't. I don't understand these feelings and emotions they sing about. Well, not at all, I've been partying like hell and I know what this is all about. But still that's not what I am. Maybe I'm one of these AI era not-quite-grown-up teenage girls having butthurt cause GD changed. Again, it's more of a personal thing, I see many people like it here and I totally understand it. Ah, you nailed it with what I bolded! Exactly. The majority of the new material simply doesn't make me feel so connected to the music and to the band as past material has. That's all. I can't connect to it in my heart. Can't really describe it better than you said it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I agree with you. The only songs on here that are really "throw away fun" are Fuck Time, Makeout Party, and maybe Stop When The Red Lights Flash. Everything else is a metaphor. Everyone's getting fooled by the party exterior I see. This is a good point; I do think that as much as ever, there is depth to the lyrics here. Lazy Bones, Wild One, Ashley, Nightlife... they can all be about more than what they seem to be. As is typical with Billie Joe's writing, there is the basic understanding, and then beyond that there are more ways to see and understand it. I respect your thoughts on it but also disagree, 21st is exactly the result of what would be expected of a band trying to recreate the success of the previous album. It sounds like I hate 21st, I don't at all, it is however the only album GD has released though that was trying to be a classic album if you will, it felt forced. When it came naturally on Dookie and AI it was a lot more fun to listen to. I just don't think it was a commercial decision. i think it was the extent of, "wow, that was fun... let's see how far we can take this now!" sort of feeling. Sort of testing personal limits. I think 21CB brought out a lot of demons and strong feelings (even if it wasn't received very strongly), and they stretched their sound to include a lot more than it had done previously. It changed the meaning of what "Green Day" was... And again, without it I don't think we would have the same vitality in these records as we do. Ah, you nailed it with what I bolded! Exactly. The majority of the new material simply doesn't make me feel so connected to the music and to the band as past material has. That's all. I can't connect to it in my heart. Can't really describe it better than you said it. I totally understand this, too. It's mostly waht I felt when I first heard "Oh Love", and then when I first heard ¡Uno! as a whole. UNO I appreciate for reasons of the way it sounds of course, and its beauty (I like the way the lyrics sound, the way he expresses himself etc, even if it is simplistic), but it isn't something I can say I could relate to... i can't really relate with Dos, either, but it has a certain draw, it's almost taboo? And that makes it appeal to me evne though it isn't somewhere I've ever been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregorovich Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 American Idiot is still their best album, but their are some good songs in UNO and DOS Well I dont think they delibrately hate Green Day, the mayority are being honest. Warning and Insomniac are really appreciated in the site and its obvious why. We have to understand that their are going to be differing opinions about an album. I'm not getting butthurt about Sputnik Music hating Dos - I've been pissed off at that site for years for delivering poor quality reviews of all kinds of albums. They just have no professionality whatsoever, and can't be considered real reviewers (it's more like a cooperative blog). In the same way that The Daily Mail cannot be considered a real paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatherotti Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I love Dos! I think its a great album. My favs off this one are 1.Lazy Bones 2.Stray Heart 3.Wild One 4.Amy But of course the entire thing is great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj_unoxx Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I bought DOS at Hot Topic today and that sticker on the top said " DOS ( pa version) ". What does that mean ? :mellow:/> "PA Version" means Parental Adivisory Version meaning its uncut and NOT censored Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Cognitive dissonance? Ha. He's on stage making out with her. There is quite a bit more to the story from what I hear. The name of the song is her name. I don't care what he said to cover his shit. The song is about her. I don't think I'm the one ignoring the evidence. Billie is not Leonard Cohen. His lyrics are quite interpretable. Now "She", meaning the character represents the things you're talking about. Lady Cobra tells a story. "I met a girl named Lady Cobra"...."She just wants to get me high"...."I just want to be friends". These are not up for interpretation in my mind. It tells the story. She represents her. I love waxing poetic so all good. Let's debate. I'd debate but I don't disagree these are also about Lady Cobra. Though I think the song Nightlife isn't so much as the song Lady Cobra itself On stage making out with her? Yeah, because that's different for Billie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farley drexel hatcher Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Why does it matter if lady cobra is about the actual woman or not? He has songs about lots of women, why is this one any different? The lyrics are quite obvious and I think he's even said its about her. I don't think he's hiding anything. I will say though that the whole "sex drugs partying" outlook on this album has undersold it. I don't see it as being that sexual (I don't count fuck time) and I don't see it about having a good time either. Not that I think it's an intended narrative but I see it as the part of the night after the partying where you don't even know who you are anymore (and not just because you're drunk, it's more of a desperate situation than that) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I will say though that the whole "sex drugs partying" outlook on this album has undersold it. I agree, and just having that "getting ready for the party---party---post-party" narrative on these albums kind of puts an arc in your head that maybe you wouldn't have seen yourself or agreed with necessarily. I understand why they branded it that way, but it does change the way you approach the lyrics and sometimes makes you disregard certain things as simply being part of that narrative. It also demands less of the listener to "figure it out for themselves" when they're being told what the whole story is vaguely supposed to be. Thinking back to Uno, although I get how it's about living in the moment and yearning, having it as the "pre-party" album really diminishes it for me. Not to mention makes zero sense for songs like Rusty James, Sweet 16... even the ones that are planning for trouble specifically, like Loss of Control and Let Yourself Go, aren't really about partying, it's such a stupid word that doesn't do justice to the story here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I agree, and just having that "getting ready for the party---party---post-party" narrative on these albums kind of puts an arc in your head that maybe you wouldn't have seen yourself or agreed with necessarily. I understand why they branded it that way, but it does change the way you approach the lyrics and sometimes makes you disregard certain things as simply being part of that narrative. It also demands less of the listener to "figure it out for themselves" when they're being told what the whole story is vaguely supposed to be. Thinking back to Uno, although I get how it's about living in the moment and yearning, having it as the "pre-party" album really diminishes it for me. Not to mention makes zero sense for songs like Rusty James, Sweet 16... even the ones that are planning for trouble specifically, like Loss of Control and Let Yourself Go, aren't really about partying, it's such a stupid word that doesn't do justice to the story here. they actually just said that it has that "getting ready for the party - party - post party" kind of feeling to it. not that every song is about partying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
localinsomniac Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I wasn't saying 21st was a failure as a whole to me, more of a disappointment that they tried in my opinion to create another concept album to recreate the success of AI. Up to that point GD were never that band that made albums specifically to be a mainstream hit, they did the opposite in fact after Dookie with Insomniac, but they sorta went into the corporate rock band mode with 21st. This is where I fall on things- I wasn't a failure, but it was very obviously a reaction to the popularity of its predecessor and pressure of following that up. It wasn't rushed - they took five years to write, record and release it - but it was forced and I think you can hear that in the songs. I do enjoy the way they speak to each other rhythmically and lyrically, although that could just as easily be construed as laziness if someone wanted to go that way with it. Insomniac was the same idea, like you said; it was reactionary. It was just a knee-jerk reaction to the backlash from punk puritans and their peers in the Bay Area. Still my favorite record to this day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 He's on stage making out with her. huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobbie Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I'm still getting my head round this album. It's certainly the most different album they have released. I do like it but I also think it is probably my least favourite GD album, which is still better than most other albums. My favourites are Ashley & Lazy Bones. One thing I am certain about is that Nightlife is the worst Green Day song ever, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tammy_cool Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 I think we just need to roll with the punches guys. Green Day were always gunna change musically. They can't keep trying to replicate American Idiot for the rest of their career. Personally I think Uno is pretty great, but I just can't get into Dos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pisquano Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Dos! should now sell around 65-70k copies in the US (first week), according to HITS forecasts... ..that is an enormous flop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykee Mexx Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Everyone is so damn sensitive around here, its insane. You don't have to love everything the band puts out. And what if so...? It ain´t good to like every song, ´cause then you´re not critical enough...? Being critical for the sake of being critical...? Concerning Dos I am in that way not critical - I fucking love every song of it! And I don´t see by the statements so far, that people are damn sensitive... Well, I am critical about Uno. Uno is the worst release of GD in my eyes. So I don´t like everything the band puts out. And I don´t like 99 Revolutions as well. So I am already critcal about Tré... And, wow, a hundred pages of deep thoughts for two handfulls of simple, party-making songs of elderly guys who just had a fucking time, and maybe a lot of wine and beer and other stuff while producing it. That´s so funny! I love you all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farley drexel hatcher Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Dos! should now sell around 65-70k copies in the US (first week), according to HITS forecasts... ..that is an enormous flop. So? They had an album out six weeks ago, the demand is not the same as with a normal release and there has been no promotion. People need to stop treating each release like a regular album release. Only certain people are actually going to go and buy every album of the trilogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tammy_cool Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 And, wow, a hundred pages of deep thoughts for two handfulls of simple, party-making songs of elderly guys who just had a fucking time, and maybe a lot of wine and beer and other stuff while producing it. That´s so funny! I love you all! Elderly guys??? GTFO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykee Mexx Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Well, it was their risk and their wish to produce a trilogy. Or as BJ once said, he made enough money already to make music for the rest of his life. So who cares about selling results... Elderly guys??? GTFO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthehallwaynow Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 Im interested to know what the Static noise crew thinks of the album.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pisquano Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 So? They had an album out six weeks ago, the demand is not the same as with a normal release and there has been no promotion. People need to stop treating each release like a regular album release. Only certain people are actually going to go and buy every album of the trilogy. If you don't care, if the majority don't care, it doesn't mean nobody cares. And starting from the fact that everyone can express his point, so there is no reason to tell them to "'stop", record labels care, since they're receiving back the same amount of money they would have got with one release (and this is rather optimistic!), having spent three times as much. Again, if you don't care about sales, and I'm not complaining about that, think that this could concern the relations between the band and the major. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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