crazyeyes Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Hey, hey, now I'm definitely not saying you can't disagree with their decision to do this. That's a good thing, actually. Makes you think and makes you stay on your toes. If you agree with everything they do, then there is something wrong, actually And the civil comment was probably a little harsh. It was just an observation. A lot of people are being pretty belligerent about it. Which, I guess comes from passion and I can't fault them for it at all. Kudos to them, really. Alright, as long as we're all cool I've just noticed that the other side of the "GREEN DAY ARE TOTES SELL OUTZZZ THEY WERE BETTER WHEN THEY WERE NOT FAMOUS" coin is the "GREEN DAY CAN DO NO WRONG HOW DARE YOU QUESTION THEM" mindset. They're human too, guys. Just like how you might not always like what your friends do, you still love them. Same thing goes for Green Day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Even if Tre Cool posed with that flyer (which a fan gave to him?) it doesn't mean much. If anything, it was the media that blew Green Day's estrangement from Walmart out of proportion. Think of it this way: initially, it was WALMART'S DECISION not to sell Green Day's music, not Green Day's decision to shun Walmart. Green Day just opted not to cooperate, and fans were like "Fuck yeah!" and gave Tre Cool that poster and the band then got caught up in the "Fuck Walmart!" which probably wasn't something they were planning on attacking in any great way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cori Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 What the heck does it matter? How is Green Day putting out a clean version of Uno going to affect anyone? Actually, a clean version is somewhat useful to me. My mom likes Green Day but isn't a big fan of all the swearing in some songs. She did, however, express an interest in wanting her own copy of Uno because she likes Oh Love so much. This works out perfectly for me in terms of that. I get my explicit version and she gets her clean version. Same way with younger kids. If parents don't want their children to hear curse words but want them to hear Uno so that they can be future Green Day fans, they can just play them the clean version. As for the whole Wal-Mart bit, I saw very few people complaining when it was announced that they would sell the Oh Love single disc. When it's something that people want they don't complain. Besides, they sell every album besides AI and 21st CB and AaF. I feel like Green Day wouldn't let clean versions of those be put out because they may have felt it would have compromised the message behind them. I'd really like to know if Dookie or Insomniac are censored in the versions I've seen at Wal-Mart, just out of curiosity. Anyways, nobody is selling out by doing this; they're just trying to market their GREAT music to a wider audience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 You are correct good sir. My objection isn't with the edited versions of the albums. They've done that before and they'll do it again, no biggie. There is still the real version widely available for anyone who wants it. My objection is with then handing it over to Wal-Mart after they specifically told them to fuck off four years ago. I would have loved to have seen them release the edited version, and then not give it to Wal-Mart as an even bigger middle finger. My inner businessman understands the decision, but my inner idealist is slightly disappointed and irked. Not going to boycot the record over this, it just slightly irritates me is all. Good to see we're cooling off and having a dialogue about this as opposed to a shouting match Yeah, I definitely know what you mean. I am indeed puzzled myself by the whole change of mood. But I do think it is out of the band's control at this point. I'm in agreement with the possibility that the band had to give up some control in order to put out three albums. I think part of the trilogy's unique marketing strategy includes Walmart. And we've already seen that with the Oh Love EP. And this is one of the few threads where people aren't having a shouting match and are actually having an intelligent argument. It's a nice change of pace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 You are correct good sir. My objection isn't with the edited versions of the albums. They've done that before and they'll do it again, no biggie. There is still the real version widely available for anyone who wants it. My objection is with then handing it over to Wal-Mart after they specifically told them to fuck off four years ago. I would have loved to have seen them release the edited version, and then not give it to Wal-Mart as an even bigger middle finger. My inner businessman understands the decision, but my inner idealist is slightly disappointed and irked. Not going to boycot the record over this, it just slightly irritates me is all. Good to see we're cooling off and having a dialogue about this as opposed to a shouting match Again, once an album is made, the label owns it. This means that the band does not have a say in what is done with it. In '09, Warner could have decided to edit 21st CB and sell it in Wal-Mart...all while Green Day was going out and saying fuck Wal-Mart. However, they did not decide to do that. This time around, Warner is deciding to take what THEY OWN and sell it in Wal-Mart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Andddddd C-Lee steps in to end the streak of intelligent and worth-while posts. He's very good at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Can I just say that, whatever side you take, I love that my favorite band is one whose fandom actually has discussions like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissawebster Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 You're not suffering tho it's your choice to buy edited or unedited noone making you to buy edited you're making wayyy to much issue out of nothing Seriously, the people who keep harping on my word "suffering" are either intentionally ignoring the point I made several times about what I meant by suffering, or it is way too complicated for you to understand. Since censorship is a common topic every student in America (and I'm assuming every other country in the world, though I don't know for sure) learns in grade school, I'm assuming you're intentionally ignoring my actual point so you can keep dismissing it as if I'm just being a drama queen playing the martyr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clayish Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Andddddd C-Lee steps in to end the streak of intelligent and worth-while posts. always mang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Seriously, the people who keep harping on my word "suffering" are either intentionally ignoring the point I made several times about what I meant by suffering, or it is way too complicated for you to understand. Since censorship is a common topic every student in America (and I'm assuming every other country in the world, though I don't know for sure) learns in grade school, I'm assuming you're intentionally ignoring my actual point so you can keep dismissing it as if I'm just being a drama queen playing the martyr. I get what you meant by suffering, but personally I think it's a little subversive anyway to sell records as "clean" which really are anything but. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissawebster Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I know Bob took it. The "Walmart is the Enemy" flyer is fan-made. No. You misunderstand. What I'm asking is if Tre Cool is actually holding that flyer with those words on them or was it photo-shopped in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clayish Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 He's very good at that. word Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 No. You misunderstand. What I'm asking is if Tre Cool is actually holding that flyer with those words on them or was it photo-shopped in? He stated that the flyer was fan-made to indicate that it was indeed a physical piece of paper in Tré's hands bearing those words . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amydc Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Actually they can if the label wants a clean album and the band doesnt and the label owns the recordings (which is Warner who owns the recordings of GD) they can legally release an edited copy even against GD wish so far they are in great hands with Warner if they were with Universal then 21st woulda been edited with a quickness Yes, but the album isn't released yet and I'm sure they were aware of all this when they signed with Warner. They are doing one-record contracts, right? Anyway let's just wait for them to say something about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 No. You misunderstand. What I'm asking is if Tre Cool is actually holding that flyer with those words on them or was it photo-shopped in? He is actually holding it up, yes. word <3 Can I just say that, whatever side you take, I love that my favorite band is one whose fandom actually has discussions like this? I can't tell if you mean this in a good way or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I can't tell if you mean this in a good way or not I mean it is good that they have fans who know how to think critically and hold meaningful discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I mean it is good that they have fans who know how to think critically and hold meaningful discussions. Good, you should mean it that way. This is a very rare occurrence, unfortunately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwen Stacy Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Even if Green Day went out of their way to demonize and shun Walmart in the past, it doesn't make them hypocrites for cooperating now Yeah, it does. But that's okay, Billie Joe does it, your grandma does it, I do it. But because they're so big and probably don't even worry about this stuff, it is our job as a responsive fanbase to remind them when they do wrong. But you're right, in the end, none of this really even matters; it's just good for us to be aware of events like this. Again, once an album is made, the label owns it. This means that the band does not have a say in what is done with it. In '09, Warner could have decided to edit 21st CB and sell it in Wal-Mart...all while Green Day was going out and saying fuck Wal-Mart. However, they did not decide to do that. This time around, Warner is deciding to take what THEY OWN and sell it in Wal-Mart. Right, but if they did anything like that without the band's consent they could kiss a huge cash cow goodbye. So realistically, they wouldn't do anything like that if the band was actually against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissawebster Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Even if Tre Cool posed with that flyer (which a fan gave to him?) it doesn't mean much. If anything, it was the media that blew Green Day's estrangement from Walmart out of proportion. Think of it this way: initially, it was WALMART'S DECISION not to sell Green Day's music, not Green Day's decision to shun Walmart. Green Day just opted not to cooperate, and fans were like "Fuck yeah!" and gave Tre Cool that poster and the band then got caught up in the "Fuck Walmart!" which probably wasn't something they were planning on attacking in any great way. I agree with this to an extent. The guys in Green Day did publicly say fuck you to Walmart in actual interviews, not just by not selling in the stores, so they did mean to attack to some extent. The main point is, they took a decided stance that they did not take this time. Can't blame fans for being confused and/or irked by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I agree with this to an extent. The guys in Green Day did publicly say fuck you to Walmart in actual interviews, not just by not selling in the stores, so they did mean to attack to some extent. The main point is, they took a decided stance that they did not take this time. Can't blame fans for being confused and/or irked by it. They basically said 'fuck you' to wal-mart afterwards, it wasn't like something they sought to say, but they said it because it came up and because the discussion would tend to invite that sort of response. Also, with 21st Century Breakdown, censoring would have had a much more detrimental effect on the content of the record. And yes, I am sure that it is a decision that hurt sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Yeah, it does. But that's okay, Billie Joe does it, your grandma does it, I do it. But because they're so big and probably don't even worry about this stuff, it is our job as a responsive fanbase to remind them when they do wrong. But you're right, in the end, none of this really even matters; it's just good for us to be aware of events like this. We have to remind them when they do something wrong? Isn't "you did something wrong" an opinion rather than a fact (in this context)? "Wrong" is very subjective and I don't think we have the duty to remind Green Day, in this case, when they're doing something wrong. We can certainly voice our displeasure, which I think is a duty of ours. But saying they're "wrong" isn't one, and shouldn't be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwen Stacy Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 We can certainly voice our displeasure, which I think is a duty of ours. With wrong being subjective, this is more to what I meant. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I agree with this to an extent. The guys in Green Day did publicly say fuck you to Walmart in actual interviews, not just by not selling in the stores, so they did mean to attack to some extent. The main point is, they took a decided stance that they did not take this time. Can't blame fans for being confused and/or irked by it. Yep, I'm slightly confused by it too. But at the same time, Green Day say "fuck you" to basically everyone [see the Billboard video interview where Billie actually said that these albums are a "fuck you to everyone"] So I see no reason to take their "Fuck Walmart" any more seriously than "Fuck the iPad," which I think any intelligent person will agree is not actually about the iPad. And if a member of Green Day owns an iPad (very possible) I would never even bother calling them a hypocrite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Yep, I'm slightly confused by it too. But at the same time, Green Day say "fuck you" to basically everyone [see the Billboard video interview where Billie actually said that these albums are a "fuck you to everyone"] So I see no reason to take their "Fuck Walmart" any more seriously than "Fuck the iPad," which I think any intelligent person will agree is not actually about the iPad. And if a member of Green Day owns an iPad (very possible) I would never even bother calling them a hypocrite. Yeah, it's more about the general ideas than about the specific things. It's about what it represents more than about what it actually is. Billie Joe has a way of giving specific examples to illustrate general concepts (without explaining that it is, in fact, the concept, and not the thing, that he is referring to) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissawebster Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Again, once an album is made, the label owns it. This means that the band does not have a say in what is done with it. In '09, Warner could have decided to edit 21st CB and sell it in Wal-Mart...all while Green Day was going out and saying fuck Wal-Mart. However, they did not decide to do that. This time around, Warner is deciding to take what THEY OWN and sell it in Wal-Mart. Yeah, Warner doesn't have absolute total control over every aspect of the records once they're produced. I know you want to blame all this on Warner and make Green Day totally and completely blameless, but it is just not the way Green Day works. They have never worked that way. They have always maintained some kind of control over the music. And if they don't and it's all been just a PR image they've presented to their fans, then it's even more hypocritical when one of them says in an interview just last week that he has Rob Cavallo's left nut in his pocket. Either he does or he doesn't. They need to make up their minds which image they want to present to the world and then own it, good and bad. 'Cause right now, they are not being consistent. It isn't a matter of either Green Day having total control over the music and marketing or Warner having total control. Most likely, it is a mutual partnership where both parties make concessions. In this case, Green Day agreed to these concessions. Making excuses for Green Day while blaming Warner completely is unnecessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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