Femme Gauche Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm still in awe that certain people, who will remain nameless because everybody already knows who I'm talking about, refuse to believe that this is all Warner's doing. It is NOT speculation. As somebody with a degree in music business, I can say with 100% certaintly that this is the case. If somebody can show me ANY major label record contract where the label doesn't have control of ALL marketing and distribution after recording is complete, I will give you my life's savings. The same thing goes for the censored version of AI being released. BREAKING NEWS...GREEN DAY DOES NOT OWN THE RIGHT TO THE AMERICAN IDIOT ALBUM. You read that correctly. Green Day has NO say in what Warner does with that album...or any album from Dookie - 21st CB. Even if they leave Warner, Warner still owns everything that Green Day has done with them up to that point. What is speculation is what Green Day's own feelings are on the matter, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 What is speculation is what Green Day's own feelings are on the matter, though. Absolutely correct :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 In which case I believe it is preferable to assert some of your own remaining control where possible - by creating a version that you like for release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissawebster Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The fact is, all of this marketing doesn't change the music. It doesn't change what it is or what they are saying, other than a couple of words which, when viewed with the whole songs, don't mean all that much. Whether or not money is a part of that decision does not make it less true that getting these albums, or any of their albums, to a larger audience ultimately brings new fans in, where the message of the music is still powerful (whether or not the message is the reason people listen). It might not be something everyone wants young kids to hear, but I think it's a pretty fucking awesome thing that they can and do. Having a censored version of an album like this is pretty fucking cool actually, because it is like saying "f--- you" to all the people who buy it thinking it is clean just because it doesn't have swear words. Oh wow. Propaganda much? Anyway, like Andres said, Green Day (from Billie's mouth) has said that the only things they care about and can control are writing and performance. They obviously have peripheral control over marketing and promo and all that, and huge control over their image, but the only things they have total control over are performance and writing. And I've NEVER seen them compromise in those realms. Recording (as in, went into the studio and "cleaned" their own songs) and releasing censored versions of their own lyrics IS compromising the writing. it's so fucking sad that some of you see this as the worlds biggest problem. It's so fucking sad you have no reading comprehension skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 It's so fucking sad you have no reading comprehension skills. what a mature thing of you to say to me. I do understand what i'm reading. some of you ARE acting like this is a way bigger problem than it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Recording (as in, went into the studio and "cleaned" their own songs) and releasing censored versions of their own lyrics IS compromising the writing. I guess I just don't see that as compromising the INTEGRITY of the ORIGINAL writing, just a means of willingly providing alternate accessibility for different audiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulS Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I for one welcome the opportunity to head down to the local school dance, sip on ma's sweet, sweet Cherry Cola, and take Peggy Sue by the hand in a handsy foxtrot to this summer's breakout smash, 'It's Above-The-Waist-Foreplay Time' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazyeyes Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Because Billie only knows the word "fuck," and we're lucky if he thinks of another adjective ever lately So in a way the censored versions could be a breath of fresh air, especially if they have more creative replacements I'm completely indifferent to cursing, but sometimes I do wonder if he couldn't have come up with a better word to use in certain situations. I will admit, the amount of times he says variations of "fuck" in Let Yourself Go and Kill the DJ borderlines being excessive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bastard of 1967 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The fact is, all of this marketing doesn't change the music. The marketing makes some of the band's words and actions inconsistent with each other. That in turn erodes their authenticity -- the sense that, as fans, we thought we knew who they are and what really matters to them. Actions have consequences. Own it and get over it please. I know everybody ignored the post the two times I made it previously, but can you say with certainty that the radio edit version of Kill the DJ isn't the way the originally intended it to be? Who's to say that Billie's original intention wasn't to have "someone kill the DJ, someone shoot the DJ" and then decided that "someone kill the DJ, shoot the fucking DJ" was more fun? So, perhaps the radio edit is the way the band originally intended it. Obviously, with songs like Fuck Time, this argument would not be in play. Can we say then that they "fucked up" Kill The DJ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 about your signature.. we've seen that on MTV since the video was released Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 This makes no difference to me in the least. If they release Row, Row, Row Your Boat as a b-side that might be cause for alarm. Nevermind, that would be awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bastard of 1967 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 about your signature.. we've seen that on MTV since the video was released I'm not talking about what's on MTV. I'm talking about what's on the band's own Youtube channel, which is exempt from FCC restrictions on vulgarity. At least the Kill the DJ trailer vocals weren't censored. I wonder if the official release next week will be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Femme Gauche Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The marketing makes some of the band's words and actions inconsistent with each other. That in turn erodes their authenticity -- the sense that, as fans, we thought we knew who they are and what really matters to them. Actions have consequences. Own it and get over it please. I never was under the impression that they were against the idea of censoring or creating censored versions of their songs; I just knew that they hadn't done it. There may be assumptions that can be drawn from that, but none of it is based solely on the actions or the words of the band themselves. I also don't think it is "low" to begin with to market toward a particular audience while still continuing to produce great music, nor to put out censored versions of a song or album; therefore I never thought that they were "above" any of it. Your impressions are your own, but that doesn't mean that they have done anything that was deceptive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bastard of 1967 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Your impressions are your own Indeed. I believe I've made my point clear that I don't like what I've seen recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 The marketing makes some of the band's words and actions inconsistent with each other. That in turn erodes their authenticity -- the sense that, as fans, we thought we knew who they are and what really matters to them. Fair, but since when have Billie Joe's actions consistently matched his words? This is a guy who is a self-proclaimed "Walking Contradiction," and if that didn't forewarn you that stuff like this would happen, I don't know what would. And I don't feel like I'm applying a song that was about something else to a different situation, I really do believe this is the exact kind of thing that song was referring to. And the fact that that song exists means that the band TAKES OWNERSHIP over their own hypocrisy, which I find admirable. Self-awareness can only lead to self-improvement, just like calling yourself an American Idiot. They probably don't fully understand their own principles regarding stuff like this, and it's obvious based on the recent inconsistency that they're torn between what they thought might be their ethics and what might not actually be an issue for them---broader distribution. It's just part of their personal self-discovery to see if that's something that matters to them. I'm not talking about what's on MTV. I'm talking about what's on the band's own Youtube channel. At least the Kill the DJ trailer vocals weren't censored. I wonder if the official release next week will be? It'll be interesting to see, eh? And if they release it uncensored, what direction does this conversation take? I have a feeling it won't be the "clean" someone shoot the DJ version, but it'll probably be the original "shoot the [bleeping] DJ" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteTim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 They arent against doing the censoring if they did they wouldnt have agreed to have longview or ai or hitchin a ride or geek stink breath or did videos for them knowing they'd have to be censored for radio and tv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermione Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Awesome As Fuck was always called Awesome As F**k on Green Day's YouTube channel (as well as on greenday.com and on the cover of the album). When greenday.com posts quotes from Billie, Mike and Tre themselves they censor the swear words! When I get emails from the Green Day mailing list or whatever it is swear words are censored again! Official Green Day outlets censoring swearing from time to time is nothing new, I don't know why anyone's surprised by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJedi Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not talking about what's on MTV. I'm talking about what's on the band's own Youtube channel, which is exempt from FCC restrictions on vulgarity. At least the Kill the DJ trailer vocals weren't censored. I wonder if the official release next week will be? i know. of course i'd much rather see the uncensored version on their channel too, but its no huge problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blitzkriegdeb Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I don't see why some people are arguing that it goes against the morals of Green Day. Here's how I see it - if they were ONLY releasing a censored version, then I'd agree with you. But, they're releasing the uncensored AND the censored version. The censored version will cater to those who want the censored version, the uncensored version will cater to those who want the uncensored version. If you want the raw music, it's there. If you want an altered version, it's there. I don't see anything wrong with that. And to anyone saying that the band is doing this for money, let's be real. I highly doubt the band we're sitting around and saying "damn dude I need more money LET'S RELEASE A CENSORED VERSION". They've made it clear over and over and over that the band isn't about money, it's about the music. If anything, having a censored version allows the music to get out more. It could open up Green Day to a whole new audience for all we know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerardsangel4977 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Of course you are. American Idiot was an admonishment of the Bush administration and conservative, religious politics. Now it isn't. Score one for the politically correct brigade. Congratulations! I'm bored with talking in circles with Warner employee trolls. Okay, seriously, you are getting WAY out of line. I've already stated that I am anti-censorship, myself (I especially despise how extensive the broadcast regulations have become), and even I think you're being incredibly rude by forcing your views and opinions on everyone else. Just because some people on this forum don't see censorship as a big issue does not give you the right to accuse them of being corporate tools and the like. They just have a different--and sometimes more well-informed---opinion than you. If I were you, I'd honestly be ashamed that a bunch of people half my age were behaving more mature than me. A large part of the reason that the argument has become circular is because you are blatantly refusing to acknowledge anyone's perspective but your own as legitimate. For example, I wrote a whole long post a few pages back explaining that this isn't the first time Green Day have allowed their stuff to be censored, in general, and that there is plenty of evidence to support the fact that the band, themselves, may not actually be anti-censorship. A point which, though you read the post and liked it, you completely failed to address, choosing instead to continue to ignore it in favor of clinging to your feelings of betrayal and moral superiority. They're censoring the entire catalogue. There will be "clean" versions of every album they've ever done now. Official videos too apparently. Billie Joe Armstrong was right. Old Green Day is gone. They've moved on. Now it's all about crash and burn pop star marketing and making as much money as they possibly can. There are no plans, as of yet, to re-release anything prior to AI censored. And I doubt there will be since all of the albums prior to AI did not have Parental Advisories to begin with. You see, the RIAA's guidelines for issuing PALs (a decision which is left up to the artist and their label, not decided on by a third-party committee) specifically allow for exceptions to be made on the grounds of artistic integrity. So if you feel the swearing or explicit themes in a song are either not excessive and/or essential to the artistic merit of a song, you can opt to not put a label on the album. And no retailer--not iTunes, or Walmart, or anyone--is allowed to then treat that recording as explicit afterward. That is why Green Day were able to go so many years without putting PALs on albums that very clearly contained explicit content and profane language. But with American Idiot, things changed. Starting with that recording--and on every album since--the band started having PALs on their albums. And those albums--with the exception of 21CB so far--are the only ones that have clean versions. Because they're the only ones that can. As for the music videos, they have *always* been censored. In fact, if you were to purchase the International Supervideos DVD they put out in 2001, which contained music videos from Dookie through Warning, you would notice that those videos have the curse words censored, even though that DVD is for private consumption and, thus, not beholden to broadcast regulations. With youtube, they have thus far taken advantage of it to show uncensored versions of their videos because they can; however, even though youtube isn't monitored by the FCC, it does contain advertising now, which could put pressure on some people to make sure their most popular videos, at least, are clean. That said, it is very possible that they really were just updating the video for quality purposes. If they had suddenly purged the entire account of all explicit content, then I'd be a bit more concerned, but that is not the case. I find it hysterical (and depressing) that other fans of the very same band that once wrote "question everything, or shut up and be the victim of authority" are now telling those of us who are asking some difficult questions about that band's current direction to just "SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!". I can't speak for everyone, but I know that I, for one, have no problem with people disagreeing with the band's views on things. But when it comes to this issue, in particular, I really wish people would just stop acting like this is the first time they've done something like this ever. Because that is just so far from true that it isn't even funny, and the more people continue to insist that it is, the more those people start to seem ignorant, at best, and delusional, at worst. I for one welcome the opportunity to head down to the local school dance, sip on ma's sweet, sweet Cherry Cola, and take Peggy Sue by the hand in a handsy foxtrot to this summer's breakout smash, 'It's Above-The-Waist-Foreplay Time' Hahahahahahahaha! I want this so badly now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack [DF] Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 They were talking about 21st that wasnt dirty record there were what 2 or 3 songs that had a cuss word on it? Yeah, but the idea was that they didn't want to censor their art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteTim Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Yeah, but the idea was that they didn't want to censor their art. Cause they felt that album didnt need to be censored they are well within their rights to do so. They said no I dont see much videos or interviews of them bashing wal mart like that. Just because they had a disagreement over one album doesn't always mean they are fuck wal mart forever. And of course it's been 3 years their attitide could have calmed down now. Answer me this have you ever felt strongly about something then months or year or so you felt differently? That's not selling out that's called maturing or growing up nothing is wrong with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather. Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Considering 21CB was the first time they said Fuck Walmart, I'm not surprised if WB was like "Look guys, that was all well and good, but 21CB didn't sell so fabulously so we're putting your albums back in Walmart" (where they had been until that point). And they're probably like, "That's fine. This trilogy was so insane we need to shoot from all directions with marketing anyway." We've already seen in interviews (Billboard) how much the band is hyper-conscious and TALKING about the marketing of this trilogy. Billie said it was going to be "multi-multi-multi-media"... They really do want their golden, crazy idea to be a success, and they're willing to do things like make a clean version because that will help the success. But there's a difference between maximizing success and maximizing profit. At the end of the day yes, they go hand in hand, but it's also more about legacy, longevity, and continued relevance. Perhaps this hurts their legacy in your eyes, but in their eyes it's one minor detail on the path to continued excellence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iop Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 What are we even talking about. When i write a song it usually has pretty rigid lyrics. You know, you write a song and you either NEED to swear or you don't need to. I mean, you choose the words you choose because you want to tell a story or you want to tell how you feel, or for whatever reason you write. What i want to say is that, at least in my eyes, there is only one version of a song that feels right for yourself. And that's the version you should play and if it contains strong vocabulary then ******* swear. (<- see, i didn't feel it was necessary to swear) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanity Loan Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 And with that, I'd be OK with closing this thread. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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