Song of the Week Jesus of Suburbia

[Metanoia]

The "I don't feel any shame..." part until the blast will always be one of the most beautiful parts in any song in this world!

[J'net]

Here's a question--when St. Jimmy "blows his brains out into the bay," is it a Fight Club deal where the JoS persona lives on, or does the JoS persona die too? Is the person watching his life crumble before deciding to give up and go home the protagonist's JoS persona, or is it the protagonist, finally free of both identities?

Neither of them really dies.

St. Jimmy represents Johnny's addiction. The fact that he "dies" and then "awakens" to wink and wave at the audience symbolizes the fact that we can't rid ourselves of an addiction. It's with us forever - even when we think we have it under control. And St. Jimmy is the most seductive addiction imaginable (which is the whole point, really ).

Both sides of Johnny live on. He's never free of either of them.

[November's Storms]

Is it possible though, that the American Idiot musical's take on the JoS storyline is different to that of the album?

[koolkev]

I think so.

Just read the story booklet of it, still don't fully understand the story, but think it actually IS a different interpretation of the song.

[November's Storms]

I think so.

Just read the story booklet of it, still don't fully understand the story, but think it actually IS a different interpretation of the song.

I remember the first time I looked in the album booklet, for some reason it was months before I checked it out. I loved the way it was done, particularly for Jesus of Suburbia, it really helps understand the emotions and the plot.

[justcause]

Neither of them really dies.

St. Jimmy represents Johnny's addiction. The fact that he "dies" and then "awakens" to wink and wave at the audience symbolizes the fact that we can't rid ourselves of an addiction. It's with us forever - even when we think we have it under control. And St. Jimmy is the most seductive addiction imaginable (which is the whole point, really ).

Both sides of Johnny live on. He's never free of either of them.

But which is the real seduction - to be a 'regular guy', or to be 'the one that's from the way outside'?

[Bastard of 1967]

Here's a question--when St. Jimmy "blows his brains out into the bay," is it a Fight Club deal where the JoS persona lives on, or does the JoS persona die too? Is the person watching his life crumble before deciding to give up and go home the protagonist's JoS persona, or is it the protagonist, finally free of both identities?

I think the show and the album complement each other well and in so doing, help answer these questions.

Homecoming begins with "Please call me only if you are coming home", which I now interpret as Jimmy talking to Johnny/JoS, pleading with him to come back under his influence and telling him in a bass-ackwards way that "if you need me, you know where to find me."....then he blows his brains out into the bay. Up to this point in the show, Jimmy and Johnny are mirroring each others' movements up until the point where Jimmy turns around on his elevated perch, draws a pistol, shoots himself in the head (a fake "BANG!" flag pops out of the pistol at this point), and then falls backwards into several ensemble members' arms, who then carry him off the stage while he's waving goodbye.

On the album, behind "we're coming home again" you can hear Tre screaming "No! I just smashed my phone!" -- another nail in Jimmy's coffin in that the cellphone metaphor that links him and JoS has just been severed.

Now back to the show -- During the reflective, regretful Whatsername, both Whatsername and Jimmy briefly appear on the set above the stage floor for a few seconds each.

My takeaway from all this is therefore that St. Jimmy doesn't so much die as go dormant. He's always back there, he's just not doing any damage "right now".

Is it possible though, that the American Idiot musical's take on the JoS storyline is different to that of the album?

Possible yes, but remember that Billie was a co-author of the "book" for the musical. His interpretation as applied to the show is just as valid as his interpretation of his own original lyrics, maybe a little more evolved with time. So -- I think it's valid to read both the album and the show together cohesively.

[Laura!]

Did Billie ever say how he came to write this song?

[justcause]

I think the show and the album complement each other well and in so doing, help answer these questions.

Homecoming begins with "Please call me only if you are coming home", which I now interpret as Jimmy talking to Johnny/JoS, pleading with him to come back under his influence and telling him in a bass-ackwards way that "if you need me, you know where to find me."....then he blows his brains out into the bay. Up to this point in the show, Jimmy and Johnny are mirroring each others' movements up until the point where Jimmy turns around on his elevated perch, draws a pistol, shoots himself in the head (a fake "BANG!" flag pops out of the pistol at this point), and then falls backwards into several ensemble members' arms, who then carry him off the stage while he's waving goodbye.

On the album, behind "we're coming home again" you can hear Tre screaming "No! I just smashed my phone!" -- another nail in Jimmy's coffin in that the cellphone metaphor that links him and JoS has just been severed.

Now back to the show -- During the reflective, regretful Whatsername, both Whatsername and Jimmy briefly appear on the set above the stage floor for a few seconds each.

My takeaway from all this is therefore that St. Jimmy doesn't so much die as go dormant. He's always back there, he's just not doing any damage "right now".

Why should it be considered that Jimmy's always doing damage, rather than questioning JOS as to his comfortable choices? To say that he represents addiction is too simple - beyond it is the part of him that the 'drug' releases - 'tell me the story of your life'. Hearing 'St Jimmy' - is that the sound of misery and compulsion? Fuck, no - it's kick-ass, it's free and joyous, it's who-you-wanna-be. Hearing 'Death of St. Jimmy' - is it 'good riddance'? Fuck, no, it's sorrow.

[luvgirlcl]

I remember the first time I looked in the album booklet, for some reason it was months before I checked it out. I loved the way it was done, particularly for Jesus of Suburbia, it really helps understand the emotions and the plot.

Just so I'm not mixing things up, by booklet you mean the 'special edition' thingy that came like a book? (Must be, because on the standar CD booklet there's nothing else besides the lyrics)...

I think it really sheds a lot of light. First, the letter on "Feb 24" sets the context of how meaningless, boring and (literally) blah his life has become, there's nothing to do, and sees that he's not the only one, because people around him are acting the same (when he says that his stepdad also forgot to shower, "is anyone noticing a pattern here?". His world has become redundant. So he develops this desire of look for something different, something even revolutionary, that breaks away and is a 180° from what his current life is ("let's start a fucking war, shall we?).

So, as we go into the song, he's admiting to who he is and what his current reality is, that he's living in a hell hole and dissapointed that his life is not what he's (or everyone's) been promised, so he comes to the realization that he doesn't really cares anymore and no one else does either, so he leaves, hoping to find something different.

On the next letter, he makes it seem like he's not just looking for something else, he's looking for something radically different from what he's gotten used to and in the way find other people like him. He's out looking for a place to belong, and this side of him is appearing, the rage, full on, St. Jimmy it's starting to cast a shadow over J, he wants to build an army, a "resistance", he wants to start a war and he wants to start a new story for himself.

So, if we look at JOS (the song), building some sort of context with the before and after letters, it could be said that JOS is not only J describing himself, his town and the need to escape from it, it's the transformation that comes from this realization, it's the lightning of a fire within him that brings out the rage, this other side of him that instead of sitting idly while everything happens, it decides to take the bull by the horns and do things his way, even if it means fucking shit up, he won't be reactive anymore, he's proactive now.

[localinsomniac]

Did Billie ever say how he came to write this song?

I can't find it, but Billie mentioned in an interview that he was just out on a walk one day when he came up with the line "I'm the son of Rage and Love." He said it just kind of went from there, I think.

[November's Storms]

What does everyone think about the "I don't care if you don't care" line?

I always think of two meanings as to what it could be.

One is that it was JoS's response to the apathy and lack of compassion and truth in the world around him in suburbia. It would explain the repetition of "I don't care if you don't, I don't care if you don't" He is saying that if nobody else is going to give a fuck he won't either.

The other is more reflective of his own character. As if somebody has said they don't care about him directly, and he replies with apathy. The person saying they don't care about him is expecting it to affect or hurt JoS but then he makes it no big deal.

I really have not phrased this in the way I wanted to at all, it is a much better discussion in my head! Just stick with the first line of this post mainly.

[J'net]

Why should it be considered that Jimmy's always doing damage, rather than questioning JOS as to his comfortable choices? To say that he represents addiction is too simple - beyond it is the part of him that the 'drug' releases - 'tell me the story of your life'. Hearing 'St Jimmy' - is that the sound of misery and compulsion? Fuck, no - it's kick-ass, it's free and joyous, it's who-you-wanna-be. Hearing 'Death of St. Jimmy' - is it 'good riddance'? Fuck, no, it's sorrow.

I agree that saying he only represents addiction is too simple. He does represent that, and that's what this production is trying to convey with the method of Jimmy's death. But he represents a lot more than that throughout the musical. He represents Johnny's wild (maybe his "truer") self. He represents that pull of whatever it is that we can't resist. And there's a reason we can't resist it. It's delicious! It's exciting!

Every time I've seen this show, I've seen love in St. Jimmy's eyes during the first part of the "Death of". St. Jimmy is very much a part of Johnny's personality - and severing that part is painful and damaging. Sorrow is a good word for the feeling it evokes. I personally love the "St. Jimmy" part of myself just as much as the part most people see every day. And it would be devastating to turn my back on it for any reason.

We can look at it as - Whatsername is the GOOD, St. Jimmy is the BAD or the WHITE/BLACK or whatever. But I've never found the two (or more) parts of myself to be that easily categorized. I could say the SERIOUS vs. the FUN-LOVING - the RESTRAINED vs. the UNINHIBITED ... and I can think of many other ways to look at it. It's not as simple as GOOD or BAD.

[luvgirlcl]

I agree that saying he only represents addiction is too simple. He does represent that, and that's what this production is trying to convey with the method of Jimmy's death. But he represents a lot more than that throughout the musical. He represents Johnny's wild (maybe his "truer") self. He represents that pull of whatever it is that we can't resist. And there's a reason we can't resist it. It's delicious! It's exciting!

Every time I've seen this show, I've seen love in St. Jimmy's eyes during the first part of the "Death of". St. Jimmy is very much a part of Johnny's personality - and severing that part is painful and damaging. Sorrow is a good word for the feeling it evokes. I personally love the "St. Jimmy" part of myself just as much as the part most people see every day. And it would be devastating to turn my back on it for any reason.

We can look at it as - Whatsername is the GOOD, St. Jimmy is the BAD or the WHITE/BLACK or whatever. But I've never found the two (or more) parts of myself to be that easily categorized. I could say the SERIOUS vs. the FUN-LOVING - the RESTRAINED vs. the UNINHIBITED ... and I can think of many other ways to look at it. It's not as simple as GOOD or BAD.

Usually I'd say that St. Jimmy is the evil, darker side that everyone has and that comes out from time to time, the side that can be self-distructive and hurt other people in the process. But all this conversation as made me think that, maybe, we can look at St. Jimmy as some sort of prototype of what Jesus wants to be or become, this image that he creates, an ideal: someone who doesn't sit back, someone who makes things happen, has fun and lives a more enjoyable life than what Jesus has been living in Jingletown, it's forgetting everything that made him sick and bored and going on to live life to the fullest, even if that includes drugs and potentially dangerous situations.

[November's Storms]

For the record, it's absolutely awesome that a thread about JOS has morphed into a discussion on the nature of St. Jimmy, a character who is at most vaguely referenced in the song.

Actually thats agood point, how does JoS reference St Jimmy aside from the music video obviously. And how does it prepare for/forewarn you of whats to come?

[ltrbmb17]

my favorite song!!!!!!!!!!!!!! EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

each line and each chord ARE GENIUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bulletproof Heart]

This is the all time favourite for me. I've listened to it continously for 6 years, and I never get tired of it. Such a genius song. I listen to a lot of other music than Green Day, but this is hands down the best song of all songs I've ever heard. At first I was disappointed by the music video. It grew on me eventually, but I prefer just listening to it and imagining my own music video in my head

[Bastard of 1967]

Why should it be considered that Jimmy's always doing damage, rather than questioning JOS as to his comfortable choices? To say that he represents addiction is too simple - beyond it is the part of him that the 'drug' releases - 'tell me the story of your life'. Hearing 'St Jimmy' - is that the sound of misery and compulsion? Fuck, no - it's kick-ass, it's free and joyous, it's who-you-wanna-be. Hearing 'Death of St. Jimmy' - is it 'good riddance'? Fuck, no, it's sorrow.

One takeaway I have from the show is that St. Jimmy prevents the protagonist from truly loving or being loved by anyone. Up until the point where Jimmy's influence wanes, the addiction comes first and everything else is secondary to that -- I mean, jeez, he turns his rage outward (instead of inward) for a brief moment and almost kills Whatsername in one scene. He does represent fuck-it-all freedom, yes, but I ask at what price does that freedom come?

So, if we look at JOS (the song), building some sort of context with the before and after letters, it could be said that JOS is not only J describing himself, his town and the need to escape from it, it's the transformation that comes from this realization, it's the lightning of a fire within him that brings out the rage, this other side of him that instead of sitting idly while everything happens, it decides to take the bull by the horns and do things his way, even if it means fucking shit up, he won't be reactive anymore, he's proactive now.

Like that.

What does everyone think about the "I don't care if you don't care" line?

I always think of two meanings as to what it could be.

One is that it was JoS's response to the apathy and lack of compassion and truth in the world around him in suburbia. It would explain the repetition of "I don't care if you don't, I don't care if you don't" He is saying that if nobody else is going to give a fuck he won't either.

The other is more reflective of his own character. As if somebody has said they don't care about him directly, and he replies with apathy. The person saying they don't care about him is expecting it to affect or hurt JoS but then he makes it no big deal.

I really have not phrased this in the way I wanted to at all, it is a much better discussion in my head! Just stick with the first line of this post mainly.

I think both exist at the same time in the same verse (if not still others we haven't thought of yet). That's where one of Billie's many gifts for writing lyrics comes in -- the ambiguous wordplay leaves just enough room to cram multiple meanings into the exact same set of words.

[TheSaltOfTheEarth]

What does everyone think about the "I don't care if you don't care" line?

I always think of two meanings as to what it could be.

One is that it was JoS's response to the apathy and lack of compassion and truth in the world around him in suburbia. It would explain the repetition of "I don't care if you don't, I don't care if you don't" He is saying that if nobody else is going to give a fuck he won't either.

The other is more reflective of his own character. As if somebody has said they don't care about him directly, and he replies with apathy. The person saying they don't care about him is expecting it to affect or hurt JoS but then he makes it no big deal.

I really have not phrased this in the way I wanted to at all, it is a much better discussion in my head! Just stick with the first line of this post mainly.

I always thought of it as the second one, a more personal feeling. The line always reminds me of something like a hurt child lashing out at everyone, even people who try to help him. JoS feels like nobody cares about him (and, correct me if I'm wrong, but this after when the girl broke up with him in the music video, I think, so that adds to the feeling), but instead of feeling bad about it, he just builds up a wall of emotionless apathy around him. It almost sounds like he feels defeated - he just can't be bothered to care about anything anymore.

I never thought about it the first way you mentioned.. This is why I love these SotW threads, you start looking at your favourite songs, the ones you think you know inside and out, in so many different ways.

[Mar]

I love the direction this thread has taken. Very interesting!

[fadi_7]

if i start i won't finish describing this awesome song

1.this song introduced me to green day so that' why it's my fave song ever !!

2.the lyrics are just great never saw better

i will reach the 1000000 and i won't be done so in short this song is absolutely my fucking type ,that's why i love and it helps throw a lot of shit and things like that ,the cool thing is that i'm listening to it NOW

[xjernpqvrnbfv]

Definetaly one of my all time favourite songs. The lyrics are relateable and amazing just like the music. It changes from poweful parts to slow parts and so on. Fantastic song, it's a fucking masterpiece!

[Saint of Suburbia]

Such an incredible song. Totally eclipses songs like Bohemina Rhapsody. Awesome performance with some 10 year old playin guitar

[addictedjamie]

Awe, that's cute

I love this song. Whenever I'm a bad mood, I go back to it and listen, and by the time it's up I feel so much better. It's just so beautiful, it sums up depressive feelings and hating your small shitty town and wanting to break out of the life that you're stereotyped into. It means so much

[Stormy Haze]

Awesome performance with some 10 year old playin guitar

That's so cute