1972 project speculation thread

[PluckyJokerhead]

2 minutes ago, Christian's Inferno! said:

Tbf we really don't know exactly what kind of effect Butch's inclusion in FOAMF had. He seems to maintain that everything about the album's sound was down to the band (almost to avoid blame for the album sounding bad), but still we can't really know exactly what kind of role he played or what extent he is responsible for the sound of that album

IMO even if this is true (which of course it has to be at least partially, the band still approved of the songs etc.) I think my larger point is that the same songs brought to producer that's a better fit for Green Day, i.e Rob Cavallo or Butch Vig, we would have gotten something entirely different

[Sanity Loan]

Here's the flow of events that is frustrating to me:

1. Green Day records a song and decides not to release it
2. Song leaks
3. Fans find out it leaks and go crazy over wanting it, expecting it to be the second coming of Jesus Christ.
4. Fans get their hands on it
5. Fans bitch and complain that it isn't great and the band has completely lost it

Gee, I wonder why the band decided to not release it...

[DearlyBeloved87]

10 minutes ago, pacejunkie punk said:

They’re just short clips. Both sound much more like FOAM outtakes I like one better than the other but neither sounds like OEB

Thanks for the info! Do you happen to know what they're called?

[PluckyJokerhead]

Just now, Sanity Loan said:

Here's the flow of events that is frustrating to me:

1. Green Day records a song and decides not to release it
2. Song leaks
3. Fans find out it leaks and go crazy over wanting it, expecting it to be the second coming of Jesus Christ.
4. Fans get their hands on it
5. Fans bitch and complain that it isn't great and the band has completely lost it

Gee, I wonder why the band decided to not release it...

This haha. I can't lie and say I wasn't curious enough to listen to the leak but I'm not going to be one to jump to any conclusions that somehow a two year old demo is somehow representitive of anything that the band might release in the near future.

I mean haven't we had enough official teasers to give us an idea of the direction they're going in?

[MillenniumFan]

6 minutes ago, Sanity Loan said:

There's a reason why it wasn't released, the band is upset it leaked, and why it has been kept a secret. And you just clearly pointed out that reason.

That makes total sense, but why did the other two snippets leak now? I was going to say it might indicate us approaching more official news. I mean, such a big leak more than half a year ahead of any official release just seems so unlikely, but if @pacejunkie punk and others are right in saying that the leaks sound more like FOAM (indicating the band may be very unhappy about the leaks), then I really don't understand what's going on. Are those snippets part of a bigger leak of demos back in 2020-2021ish that was just kept under wraps by the band/management? And if so, are these therefore all demos in the early stages of development and less representative of what the band intends to release in their album next year? 

[pacejunkie punk]

2 minutes ago, MillenniumFan said:

But why did the other two snippets leak now? I was going to say it might indicate us approaching more official news, I mean, such a big leak more than half a year ahead of a release just seems unlikely, but if @pacejunkie punk and others are right in saying that they sounds more like FOAM, then I really don't understand what's going on. Was this a part of bigger leak of demos back in 2020-2021ish that was kept under wraps by the band/management? And if so, are these therefore all demos in the early stages of development and less representative of what the band intends to release in their album next year? 

They didn’t. They leaked at the same time OEB did

 

 

2 minutes ago, PluckyJokerhead said:

This haha. I can't lie and say I wasn't curious enough to listen to the leak but I'm not going to be one to jump to any conclusions that somehow a two year old demo is somehow representitive of anything that the band might release in the near future.

I mean haven't we had enough official teasers to give us an idea of the direction they're going in?

I agree, we should only be going by the official teasers to get an idea of the sound of the next album

[MillenniumFan]

1 minute ago, pacejunkie punk said:

They didn’t. They leaked at the same time OEB did

Ah see I didn't know that. I thought only one song had leaked. When was that again? People (including myself) seem to be confused about when what leaked. 

[Christian's Inferno!]

I honestly don't care about the other leaks, unless the full songs are going to leak at some point. The only reason I cared about the OEB leak is because I assumed that the full song was going to be leaked at some point. It just seemed like too many people had the full song and too many people knew about it that it was inevitable

If nobody has actually even heard the other 2 leaked songs in full, apart from the band and people involved with the band, then I don't see the full songs leaking and idc to hear the snippets unless the band posts them, especially if they're not even going to be on the album

[MillenniumFan]

6 minutes ago, PluckyJokerhead said:

This haha. I can't lie and say I wasn't curious enough to listen to the leak but I'm not going to be one to jump to any conclusions that somehow a two year old demo is somehow representitive of anything that the band might release in the near future.

I mean haven't we had enough official teasers to give us an idea of the direction they're going in?

In terms of song content agreed. I also think the other hints & official leaks are stronger indicators of future production. Nonetheless this has strengthened my view that the staffing (Cavallo & CLA) in particular will most likely lead to a better produced album than we've heard from GD in quite a while. But I already thought that the instant I heard their names tbh. 

[pacejunkie punk]

2 minutes ago, MillenniumFan said:

Ah see I didn't know that. I thought only one song had leaked. When was that again? People seem to be confused in terms of dates.

The end of 2020 afaik

[MillenniumFan]

12 minutes ago, pacejunkie punk said:

The end of 2020 afaik

Right. In that case though this might well have been before Cavallo & CLA even started working on the project... If so, then this has been a big hoo-ha for nothing  dear oh dear. Wouldn't be the first time though. 

Just a shame those demos leaked when they did to be honest. I mean, as a major fan of the band, it's always great to hear demos no doubt, but if these demos are so unrepresentative of the final album, then I would have rather they leaked later when the album was already out. Cooler to hear official songs leaked close to a release and and I think all credible sources seem to indicate we're still over half a year away from that. 

Right, back to listening to the 1972 studio leaks on loop 

[pcj]

33 minutes ago, pacejunkie punk said:

They’re just short clips. Both sound much more like FOAM outtakes I like one better than the other but neither sounds like OEB

Is it fair to say one leak could have been accidental, but three. Is there something going on here?

I suppose it's way too crazy to consider these are official teasers?

[MillenniumFan]

5 minutes ago, pcj said:

Is it fair to say one leak could have been accidental, but three. Is there something going on here?

I suppose it's way too crazy to consider these are official teasers?

That's what I initially thought, which is why I didn't believe the first reports of the additional leaks until Matt confirmed them. That said, it seems what has happened here is that one full song and two snippets leaked in 2020 and simply flew under the radar until now. Might sound implausible, but seeing that Covid and a delayed world tour came in between then and now, both of which were major distractions any way you look at it, it's not so implausible after all. 

[Christian's Inferno!]

11 minutes ago, MillenniumFan said:

Right, back to listening to the 1972 studio leaks on loop 

They were posted by the band's social media though. Doesn't that make them not leaks?

[MillenniumFan]

2 minutes ago, Christian's Inferno! said:

They were posted by the band's social media though. Doesn't that make them not leaks?

Yeah I guess not. Teasers then

[pacejunkie punk]

22 minutes ago, pcj said:

Is it fair to say one leak could have been accidental, but three. Is there something going on here?

I suppose it's way too crazy to consider these are official teasers?

They were all unauthorized

[Christian's Inferno!]

If they do end up releasing the song officially either as a standalone or album track, I'm guessing they'll change verse 3 to be its own verse, instead of being a repeat of verse 1. That to me is really the only thing suggesting that this is a demo rather than a completed track. It honestly sounds more complete than like at least half of FOAMF

[That Dude]

Oh great, the split second I hear One Eyed Monster, more songs leak.   

My ship is going down and Mike Dirnt's watching me drown.  Why is he laughing so much?    

I like the song.  It's got some odd guitar parts that stand out quite a bit.  Some of the lyrics are kind half baked from what I can understand and as usual, it's hard to say what this song is about.  

But it's good.

 

[MillenniumFan]

1 hour ago, Christian's Inferno! said:

Idk that much about production or mixing tbh but I think 21CB sounds amazing. What exactly is it that you think makes it not as good as previous albums? @MillenniumFan

Hmm, that's an interesting question. I think setting aside that good production is theoretically always a matter of taste, I don't think that Butch Vig is a bad producer, in fact, he's clearly one of the greats and his record speaks volumes. And in hindsight, 21CB honestly sounds great. The songs on 21CB were often complex and multi-layered. He made the band sound huge, which is not a bad thing at all. 

In fact -  I often find myself enjoying the depth of the songs - which is also why I'd say production is a matter of taste. 

But I feel like Cavallo understood the band in a way that Butch Vig didn't. He could make them sound huge if he needed to, sure, but metaphorically speaking, he also knew when and how to turn the volume knob up and down, always to suit the occasion. This is important in my view, because less can be more, especially with a band like Green Day, which excels through simplicity, I would argue. 

Butch Vig adding a lot of depth and many layers to 21CB songs is not to be confused with Walker's style of lazily slapping on effects for no good reason. Vig knew what he was doing. But I think he didn't know Green Day enough to see that they didn't always have to sound huge and grandiose. I think he could have asked them to tone things down occasionally and to strip some of the polish, to bring in extra dynamics and variance. 

What this ultimately means is that whilst I adore listening to individual songs on 21CB, and as stand-alone songs there are many many great songs on that album, as a cohesive/integrated listening experience, I much prefer listening to Warning, Nimrod or AI from start to finish. I never get tired of the clever transitions in AI or the great sonic diversity and change of pace in Warning & Nimrod. 

On the other hand, I find that when listening to 21CB's grandiose, huge and often quite complex and multi-layered production, I can easily get fatigued and decide to break it off after a few songs or so. The length of the album of course doesn't help. 

But this is of course all a matter of taste. As much as I was able to see its flaws back in 2009, seeing that at the time it stood in the direct shadow of AI, I have over the years come to appreciate many individual songs on 21CB and I think viewed in isolation, it has some of the band's most accomplished work hands down, musically and especially lyrically. 

As a cohesive album, however, it will always remain in AI's shadow in my opinion and the (relative) simplicity of the band's earlier albums, means I also rank it below the likes of Dookie, Nimrod or Warning. 

[Christian's Inferno!]

The subreddit moderators seem to be deleting any thread about the leaked song. I don't think they usually delete entire threads unless they're actually posting the link or something in it. But discussion of the song should be allowed, right? I wonder if they're being pressured by the band's management to delete any discussion about it. Because that's probably where most people are going to hear about the song if it's posted there, right?

[Little Boy Named Booze]

Yeah I don't get it either.

[pcj]

26 minutes ago, MillenniumFan said:

Hmm, that's an interesting question. I think setting aside that good production is theoretically always a matter of taste, I don't think that Butch Vig is a bad producer, in fact, he's clearly one of the greats and his record speaks volumes. And in hindsight, 21CB honestly sounds great. The songs on 21CB were often complex and multi-layered. He made the band sound huge, which is not a bad thing at all. 

In fact -  I often find myself enjoying the depth of the songs - which is also why I'd say production is a matter of taste. 

But I feel like Cavallo understood the band in a way that Butch Vig didn't. He could make them sound huge if he needed to, sure, but metaphorically speaking, he also knew when and how to turn the volume knob up and down, always to suit the occasion. This is important in my view, because less can be more, especially with a band like Green Day, which excels through simplicity, I would argue. 

Butch Vig adding a lot of depth and many layers to 21CB songs is not to be confused with Walker's style of lazily slapping on effects for no good reason. Vig knew what he was doing. But I think he didn't know Green Day enough to see that they didn't always have to sound huge and grandiose. I think he could have asked them to tone things down occasionally, to bring in extra dynamics and variance. 

What this ultimately means is that whilst I adore listening to individual songs on 21CB, and as stand-alone songs there are many many great songs on that album, as a cohesive/integrated listening experience, I much prefer listening to Warning, Nimrod or AI from start to finish. I never get tired of the clever transitions in AI or the great sonic diversity and change of pace in Warning & Nimrod. 

On the other hand, I find that when listening to 21CB's grandiose, huge and often quite complex and multi-layered production, I can easily get fatigued and decide to break it off after a few songs or so. The length of the album of course doesn't help. 

But this is of course all a matter of taste. As much as I was able to see its flaws back in 2009, seeing that at the time it stood in the direct shadow of AI, I have over the years come to appreciate many individual songs on 21CB and I think viewed in isolation, it has some of the band's best work hands down, musically and especially lyrically. 

As a cohesive album, however, it will always remain in AI's shadow in my opinion and the (relative) simplicity of the band's earlier albums, means I also rank it below the likes of Dookie, Nimrod or Warning. 

Respect your view. Imho I think it's difficult to compare albums from a different era.

  Their 20th century 90's albums, not forgetting the dark but awesome Insomniac album, including Warning (2000), saw the band progress and grow. 

In to the 21 century AI onwards, I see as another GD era taking them to next level. Not forgetting amazing RevRad.

 

[Flynn]

The one I saw was asking peoples thoughts on the song, so my guess for that one at least is it encourages people to seek or ask about it (which most likely isn't allowed) and perhaps they just want as few of people to know about it. Not saying I agree with it fully but with that logic it makes sense.

[DookieLukie]

7 minutes ago, Christian's Inferno! said:

The subreddit moderators seem to be deleting any thread about the leaked song. I don't think they usually delete entire threads unless they're actually posting the link or something in it. But discussion of the song should be allowed, right? I wonder if they're being pressured by the band's management to delete any discussion about it. Because that's probably where most people are going to hear about the song if it's posted there, right?

It’s Reddit. Mods have the courage of a field mouse and the integrity of a Wall Street investor.

[MillenniumFan]

8 minutes ago, Christian's Inferno! said:

The subreddit moderators seem to be deleting any thread about the leaked song. I don't think they usually delete entire threads unless they're actually posting the link or something in it. But discussion of the song should be allowed, right? I wonder if they're being pressured by the band's management to delete any discussion about it. Because that's probably where most people are going to hear about the song if it's posted there, right?

It's probably easier to moderate by closing entire threads than by hunting down individual people posting links to the leaks in said threads, as is bound to happen. But perhaps you're right. It would make sense in light of the fact that these were unintended leaks from 2020 and, as seems likely, the next album will not drop until next year, almost four years later. In that case, a big discussion about leaks from 2020 going viral right now would blow up in the band's face, at least from a marketing perspective.