Hella Mega Tour with Weezer, Fall Out Boy

[Vintage Disciple]

On 2/25/2022 at 9:29 AM, pacejunkie punk said:

Green Day should announce they’re not playing in Moscow. Make a statement of it that they won’t support the Russian economy that finances their military.  Why do I suspect instead that they’ll just quietly take the show off their schedule without a word?

I wish they would announce it and make a statement that while they love the Russian people they don't support Putin.

[Guest]

19 hours ago, Beerjeezus said:

What you’re not getting is the train of thought that goes from this simple but sad truth to legitimizing the invasion - which is understandable, it’s not the most logical progression that you’d come up with rationally. What they’re saying is that since Putin took over Donbas and the world has been looking away, Ukrainian far-right paramilitary groups have been attacking the separatists (this is still, as far as I know, true at least to an extent. They’ve taken part in the 2014 conflict and unfortunately, I doubt they’ve fucked off since) and these people are Putin’s pretext for claiming that Ukraine is a fascist state that needs to be contained. That’s how the story goes from the Russian perspective.

Thank you for explaining this. I see what you mean. There has indeed been divisions and violence within Ukraine in recent years. But these conflicts have been largely stoked by Russia. And as I heard someone say on TV this morning, I highly doubt Ukraine would "try something" when Russia had hundreds of thousands of troops amassed on their border. Putin went looking to for a reason to invade (like creating fake videos of Ukrainian attacks). I know we are on the same page on this, and I know this won't change anything for the same kind of people who want to believe that Barack Obama eats infants, but I just wanted to add my two cents to this. Putin has a habit of looking for places in conflict to assert his influence (think his support of Assad and intervention in Syria), and this is no different. 

Ironically, Putin's invasion seems to have united the Ukrainians and also united NATO, which was in shambles after Trump. It's starting to look like he seriously miscalculated this and the world at large is finally not buying his propaganda.

[Cunt]

2 hours ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

which was in shambles after Trump

This man lives rent free in your mind. Very unhealthy to obsess over someone so much. If you want to look for someone to blame maybe you should look at the people who allowed Russia to complete the pipeline to Germany. I’m sure that may or may not have something with Russia wanting to push into Ukraine then probably ultimately more west after that. Or we can blame a guy who hasn’t been in office for over a year and under that last year of his administration offered the greatest amount of foreign aid to Ukraine since 1994. 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Cunt said:

This man lives rent free in your mind. Very unhealthy to obsess over someone so much. If you want to look for someone to blame maybe you should look at the people who allowed Russia to complete the pipeline to Germany. I’m sure that may or may not have something with Russia wanting to push into Ukraine then probably ultimately more west after that. Or we can blame a guy who hasn’t been in office for over a year and under that last year of his administration offered the greatest amount of foreign aid to Ukraine since 1994. 

Dude, you do realize you are the one who keeps obsessing about Trump right? This is literally the first time I have mentioned him since he left office. And if you have actually been reading anything I have been saying in this thread the past few days, I have been talking about how the entire Western world failed to take the threat of Russia seriously over the past eight years. That means many many people are to blame. And I will be the first to point fingers at Germany too for being very slow to react to the threat and not taking it seriously and wanting Russia's oil. So if you care about this situation, I would start focusing on what you can do to help rather than trying to defend the honor of an out-of-office politician who definitely does not care about you anywhere near as much as you care about him.

[Beerjeezus]

2 hours ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

Thank you for explaining this. I see what you mean. There has indeed been divisions and violence within Ukraine in recent years. But these conflicts have been largely stoked by Russia. And as I heard someone say on TV this morning, I highly doubt Ukraine would "try something" when Russia had hundreds of thousands of troops amassed on their border. Putin went looking to for a reason to invade (like creating fake videos of Russian attacks). I know we are on the same page on this, and I know this won't change anything for the same kind of people who want to believe that Barack Obama eats infants, but I just wanted to add my two cents to this. Putin has a habit of looking for places in conflict to assert his influence (think his support of Assad and intervention in Syria), and this is no different. 

Ironically, Putin's invasion seems to have united the Ukrainians and also united NATO, which was in shambles after Trump. It's starting to look like he seriously miscalculated this and the world at large is finally not buying his propaganda.

I'm sorry, but I'm not sure you understand. This isn't about Putin's claims the current conflict was provoked. He was most definitely looking for an excuse, but that doesn't change anything about the fact that there was an ongoing conflict that went on since 2014. I also wouldn't say this is comparable to Russia's involment in Syria. The wars in Chechnya in the 90s and in Georgia in 2008 are a lot closer to this.

 

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, Beerjeezus said:

I'm sorry, but I'm not sure you understand. This isn't about Putin's claims the current conflict was provoked. He was most definitely looking for an excuse, but that doesn't change anything about the fact that there was an ongoing conflict that went on since 2014. I also wouldn't say this is comparable to Russia's involment in Syria. The wars in Chechnya in the 90s and in Georgia in 2008 are a lot closer to this.

 

No, I wouldn't say this is at all comparable to Syria since Russia did not itself invade Syria, though they did offer support to Assad as he committed horrible atrocities against his people. But yes, you raise good points about Chechnya and Georgia, especially Georgia. Putin has actively worked to destabilize Russia's neighbors for many years and then gets all, "Oh look world, X country is volatile, time for me to intervene" and the rest of the world has been all too eager to believe it or, if they didn't believe it, at least not treat it like a big deal. And that got us to where we are today. I have literally spent the past three days saying over and over how there has been ongoing conflict in Ukraine for the past 8 years largely instigated by Putin and that the rest of the world has not taken it seriously and that is why we now are where we are. I don't know what else you want me to say. This is starting to feel like a giant mind fuck. 

Further, there is a serious problem here that the Ukraine conflict is being taken very seriously (as it should be), but the civil wars and various other conflicts in Syria, Yemen, Myanmar, parts of Africa, parts of South America, etc., have not been. No one praised and supported those people fighting for their freedom, and when their refugees showed up on America's and Europe's shores, we told them to fuck off. So apparently we only care about human suffering when the humans suffering are white.

[Beerjeezus]

6 minutes ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

Further, there is a serious problem here that the Ukraine conflict is being taken very seriously (as it should be), but the civil wars and various other conflicts in Syria, Yemen, Myanmar, parts of Africa, parts of South America, etc., have not been. No one praised and supported those people fighting for their freedom, and when their refugees showed up on America's and Europe's shores, we told them to fuck off. So apparently we only care about human suffering when the humans suffering are white.

It's not just about race, it's about suffering we caused. People in the Middle East and Africa are also our victims. There's racism, there's xenophobia and there's also refusal to look these people in the eye and accept responsibility for ruining their lives. It's easier to emphatise with people who are running away from bombs that we aren't dropping.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Beerjeezus said:

It's not just about race, it's about suffering we caused. People in the Middle East and Africa are also our victims. There's racism, there's xenophobia and there's also refusal to look these people in the eye and accept responsibility for ruining their lives. It's easier to emphatise with people who are running away from bombs that we aren't dropping.

I agree. The whole common thread to all of this is the first world not wanting to take responsibility for the suffering it causes. So I don't understand what you are saying I don't understand, since we seem to keep saying the same things over and over.

[JAS0N]

On 2/25/2022 at 9:29 AM, pacejunkie punk said:

Green Day should announce they’re not playing in Moscow. Make a statement of it that they won’t support the Russian economy that finances their military.  Why do I suspect instead that they’ll just quietly take the show off their schedule without a word?

It has now been removed from their tour dates without a word, so far anyway.

[cav9mm]

Formally announced on their insta

https://instagram.com/stories/greenday/2783105044618494059?utm_source=ig_story_item_share&utm_medium=copy_link

[pacejunkie punk]

Well it’s not exactly the statement I thought it would be. Much too wishy washy to just say this isn’t the time for a rock concert. How about saying this is a protest against Putin’s unjust war? These guys used to be punk and take political stances.

I mean they can’t even say they are canceling to show solidarity with Ukraine? That’s not even controversial. The whole world is doing that. When did these guys lose their balls?  

[Beerjeezus]

3 minutes ago, pacejunkie punk said:

Well it’s not exactly the statement I thought it would be. Much too wishy washy to just say this isn’t the time for a rock concert. How about saying this is a protest against Putin’s unjust war? These guys used to be punk and take political stances.

Maybe they don't want to close their door to playing there in the future? Many recent cancellations (mainly from sports organizations though) also went with a condemnation of Putin's aggression.

[jengd]

21 minutes ago, pacejunkie punk said:

Well it’s not exactly the statement I thought it would be. Much too wishy washy to just say this isn’t the time for a rock concert. How about saying this is a protest against Putin’s unjust war? These guys used to be punk and take political stances.

I mean they can’t even say they are canceling to show solidarity with Ukraine? That’s not even controversial. The whole world is doing that. When did these guys lose their balls?  

Sounded to me like lawyer speak rather than the band.

[Little Boy Named Booze]

Really don't like their excuse for not going in Russia.

Making statement isn't their best thing in the Armstrong family.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Beerjeezus said:

Maybe they don't want to close their door to playing there in the future? Many recent cancellations (mainly from sports organizations though) also went with a condemnation of Putin's aggression.

I think they made a reasonable statement. I would hardly call the cancellation a protest against Putin anyway, since I seriously doubt Putin is a Green Day fan LOL. Of course they want to go back when the time is right. 3,000 Russians have been arrested for protesting this war already (and stop and consider for a moment what arrest means in Russia). The Russian people are not to blame and condemning Russia is not an appropriate response.

[Virginia Lot Lizard]

They have been playing it safe for a long time. There’s no way the same guy who wrote a letter to a grandmother telling her to fuck off is the same guy in this band. Or the band that took Pansy Division on tour and told a bunch of people to fuck off. He’s at home being boring and sheltered and not doing anything to rock the boat. I’m pleasantly surprised he did the Longshot tour but that’s about it. Ivory Tower and keeping the status quo.

The random thoughts thread talking about the Rev and Fink putting Billie Joe into the fetal position and begging for mercy is incredibly apt.

I love Billie Joe but the past few years are disappointing in several ways. Totally not one to make much of statement or get too uncomfortable. I miss the wild impulsive passionate guy. I still like this guy but… Yeah… Totally a safe player and not too dramatic or passionate anymore.

[Beerjeezus]

9 minutes ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

I think they made a reasonable statement. I would hardly call the cancellation a protest against Putin anyway, since I seriously doubt Putin is a Green Day fan LOL. Of course they want to go back when the time is right. 3,000 Russians have been arrested for protesting this war already (and stop and consider for a moment what arrest means in Russia). The Russian people are not to blame and condemning Russia is not an appropriate response.

Not doing business in Russia is de facto a part of the internatonal embargo. It’s not about spiting Putin personally.

[Cunt]

1 hour ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

Dude, you do realize you are the one who keeps obsessing about Trump right? This is literally the first time he have mentioned him since he left office. And if you have actually been reading anything I have been saying in this thread the past few days, I have been talking about how the entire Western world failed to take the threat of Russia seriously over the past eight years. That means many many people are to blame. And I will be the first to point fingers at Germany too for being very slow to react to the threat and not taking it seriously and wanting Russia's oil. So if you care about this situation, I would start focusing on what you can do to help rather than trying to defend the honor of an out-of-office politician who definitely does not care about you anywhere near as much as you care about him.

You do realize that you bring him up on this forum more than anyone else unprovoked right?  You do realize that Russia has been a threat for more than just the last 8 years right? (Try twice that amount of time). You do realize that Joe Biden helped approve that pipeline and it wasn’t just Germany right? So maybe instead of complaining about what Donald trump did or didn’t do you should focus on holding the people that are in charge now accountable.

[Beerjeezus]

34 minutes ago, Virginia Lot Lizard said:

They have been playing it safe for a long time. There’s no way the same guy who wrote a letter to a grandmother telling her to fuck off is the same guy in this band. Or the band that took Pansy Division on tour and told a bunch of people to fuck off. He’s at home being boring and sheltered and not doing anything to rock the boat. I’m pleasantly surprised he did the Longshot tour but that’s about it. Ivory Tower and keeping the status quo.

The random thoughts thread talking about the Rev and Fink putting Billie Joe into the fetal position and begging for mercy is incredibly apt.

I love Billie Joe but the past few years are disappointing in several ways. I miss the wild impulsive passionate guy. I still like this guy but… Yeah… Totally a safe player and not too dramatic or passionate.

To be fair - he’s just a guy trying to live his best life. Most people become sort of comfortable in their lives as they get older and that’s a part of life. And most importantly, he’s not someone in a position of power. If he doesn’t want to be vocal about something, it doesn’t make a lot of impact on the world.

[DookieLukie]

40 minutes ago, Virginia Lot Lizard said:

They have been playing it safe for a long time. There’s no way the same guy who wrote a letter to a grandmother telling her to fuck off is the same guy in this band. Or the band that took Pansy Division on tour and told a bunch of people to fuck off. He’s at home being boring and sheltered and not doing anything to rock the boat. I’m pleasantly surprised he did the Longshot tour but that’s about it. Ivory Tower and keeping the status quo.

The random thoughts thread talking about the Rev and Fink putting Billie Joe into the fetal position and begging for mercy is incredibly apt.

I love Billie Joe but the past few years are disappointing in several ways. Totally not one to make much of statement or get too uncomfortable. I miss the wild impulsive passionate guy. I still like this guy but… Yeah… Totally a safe player and not too dramatic or passionate anymore.

Removing drugs and alcohol probably mellowed him out a bit. No more rash decisions.

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Beerjeezus said:

Not doing business in Russia is de facto a part of the internatonal embargo. It’s not about spiting Putin personally.

Exactly. Once again we seem to be on the page here. They are refusing to add money to the Russian economy, and I think that is the right thing to do. Not really sure what more anyone wants from them. Would it be nice to say something about Putin? Yes, and I am sure they will, just as they have said things about many other leaders. I don't necessarily think that this announcement would be the place for that since, as you just said, the cancellation does not personally affect Putin. Further, this statement was likely released by the band's management and not the band personally.

20 hours ago, Cunt said:

You do realize that you bring him up on this forum more than anyone else unprovoked right?  You do realize that Russia has been a threat for more than just the last 8 years right? (Try twice that amount of time). You do realize that Joe Biden helped approve that pipeline and it wasn’t just Germany right? So maybe instead of complaining about what Donald trump did or didn’t do you should focus on holding the people that are in charge now accountable.

I would like some examples of times I brought up Trump after he left office before today. Russia has been a threat in various capacities since the end of the second world war. Basically every U.S. war since then, from Korea to Vietnam to Afghanistan (because we funded the forces opposing Russia who then turned into the Taliban), has been a form of a proxy war with Russia, and none of them have worked or else we would not be in the current situation. I never said Joe Biden did not bear responsibility, because he certainly does. The entire Western world and all of its leaders over the past couple of decades bear responsibility in allowing Putin to become what he now is. You are arguing with positions I have not made. And you do realize Russian state TV now basically has on loop Trump's statements praising Putin, right? And if your default response to everything is to defend Donald Trump over every criticism like some kind of brainwashed cult follower and you are more concerned about people being mean to him than you are about people dying in Ukraine, that's not a great look.

[Beerjeezus]

22 minutes ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

Exactly. Once again we seem to be on the page here. They are refusing to add money to the Russian economy, and I think that is the right thing to do. Not really sure what more anyone wants from them. Would it be nice to say something about Putin? Yes, and I am sure they will, just as they have said things about many other leaders. I don't necessarily think that this announcement would be the place for that since, as you just said, the cancellation does not personally affect Putin. Further, this statement was likely released by the band's management and not the band personally.

No, not really, I'm saying the opposite. - This isn't a personal beef between Putin and BJA as individuals. This is about a business withdrawing from a country that's being sanctioned. The announcement it exactly where it belongs if the management decides to cite the reason for cancelling. I don't expect the band to make any geopolitical statements on their personal social media. 

[purplebenny]

Did people really expect the band to make an actual statement?

this is from management, it’s that simple, and no one should expect anything further or more personal

and it’s 100% the right call.

[Cunt]

21 minutes ago, Lady Mix-A-Lot said:

you are more concerned about people being mean to him than you are about people dying in Ukraine, that's not a great look.

Really?… I would say I’m shocked to read such a classless thing but I’m not. Also Donald Trumps comments on Putin aren’t exactly praise it’s more so recognition in the fact that Putin isn’t an idiot. But then again left wing pop culture conformism believes in everything whether it’s taken out of context or not. Just read the headlines and you have everything thing you need right? As long as it fits the agenda. 

[Lindsay]

Alright, I know I've been guilty of this as well but let's try to keep this on topic (as much as possible) about GD & Hella Mega. I'm obviously fine with keeping the discussion on GD's decision to cancel their Russian date in here, but if you guys want to discuss the war in the Ukraine in more detail please move it here.

 Also NOT calling anyone out with this post as I don't think we've been off topic too much, just trying to move the general war discussion there before it becomes that way.